Ted Re..Germany is pissed at the US so its refused to comply with provisions required of it under the NATO treaty; that is, supply missiles or whatever to Turkey.
Agreed
Turkey already understands that its not personal; that Germany is failing to comply in order to piss off the US.
Possibly. If Turkey did understand that, then why did Turkey call an emergency meeting Monday, and resubmit the proposal; just to embarrass Schroeder.
However, Germany decided to go the extra mile by providing the missiles outside the auspices of NATO. Why?
Because Germany was getting killed for possibly causing the breakup of NATO, and Germany didn't want to go there yet. Schroeder and Chirac wanted GW to be blamed, then they would have been happy, but when Turkey called the special meeting, and Rummy called them out; Schroeder folded. You might be right, that they want a new alliance, without the US, but they also wanted GW to take the fall. They probably will wait for a better opportunity to blame Gw.
First, the German makers of the missiles will get paid and won't get screwed over by this political flap with the US.
The missiles were Patriots, and I believe the US manufactures them, however, Germany, or NATO in Germany had them.
Thirdly, it continues to keep its middle finger up so the US doesn't forget where it stands.
Agreed. Now is that the civilized thing for them to do.
From where I'm sitting, France and Germany are very serious about this breach, and if Blair gets dethroned, the UK will be right behind them.
Possible, however, other than the fact that they are liberal, and GW is conservative, why is GW automatically wrong here. Isn't it possible a lot of the blame falls with them also. Just as there is a clash of cultures between the arabs and us, isn't it possible that the US and Europe have different values wit us also. That doesn't mean anybody is wrong, just different.
I know you all don't believe in polls but I would give the latest one at least a cursory look.
I don't know what you are trying to say here. I know Europe has different values, and they possibly wnat to go their separate ways. So what. They can do that if they wish. NATO though won't survive it, and probably shouldn't. Right now America spends close to a billion on NATO's defense, which if the Europeans go on their own, will have to be picked up by them. It also means the UN is meaningless, because it would be unlikely anything will be agreed upon by its diverging members; so the UN is likely to go back to being a debating society without any significance.
You've pointed out Bush's achilles heel. His/your hubris is what got us into this mess. I wouldn't count on Germany and France being the only countries to get hurt by this flap.
You can blame Gw all you want for the differences in cultures. However, that is ignoring the fact that the differences in cultures have been increasing all through the nineties. Mainly I think because Europe has been stagnating ever since the EU started, and they are getting an inferiority complex, which exploded with Iraq. The EU expected big things from the union, however it didn't materialize, so when in a pinch, do what everybody else does, blame America.
This is not WW II so stop with the drama. Its only a time of war because Mr. Bush has made it that.
Wrong again, it is a time of war because OBL declared war, and a lot of Arab nations support terrorism and or Al qaeda. Saddam has supported terrorists for yrs, mainly the anti Israel groups, but Al qaeda seems to be gaining in influence in Iraq. |
