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Pastimes : Neocon's Seminar Thread

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To: Neocon who wrote (411)	4/23/2001 3:24:06 PM
From: cAPSLOCK	Read Replies (1) of 1112

The notion of hell has always troubled me as well. As a matter of fact, I imagine it is troubling by nature. Lk. 16:19 is frequently invoked first in a defense of the doctrine of hell. This is the story, told by Christ, of the rich man and the poor man (Lazarus, leper). They die and the rich man looks up from burning torment to ask Lazarus and Abraham for water... But this story does not entirely support the concept of hell. Not any more than the concept of purgatory. I have also been troubled by the ideas of hell and grace trying to coexist. Which are we saved by: works or grace? I think the spirit of the entire New Testament and a large part of the Old is grace. Now if I take the popular(?) notion of hell as eternal damnation and apply it to this scripture then there is a problem. John 5 28 "Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice 29 and come out--those who have done good will rise to live, and those who have done evil will rise to be condemned. If this is a description of judgement resulting in eternal punishment or reward, then we have quite a different doctrine than grace at the center of salvation. I am also unable to reconcile a neighboring passage (in context actually): 24 "I tell you the truth, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be condemned; he has crossed over from death to life. This standard must concern a greater issue... Or Jesus contradicts himself about 2 sentences later. On the other hand... what can we do with this? 2 Thessalonians 1 7 ... This will happen when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven in blazing fire with his powerful angels. 8 He will punish those who do not know God and do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. 9 They will be punished with everlasting destruction and shut out from the presence of the Lord and from the majesty of his power. I have never been able to settle this question for myself. cAPSLOCK

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