It's amazing that for all your knowledge you have never heard of "GENERAL REVELATION". The bible clearly teaches it. Psalm 19:, Romans 1: 2:, Act's 17:. All men, you included, have God's Law "written on their hearts". Idiolatry has no effect on this, hence it is by instinct or nature that Man is and has always been, a moral creature. Man knows right and wrong the way a newborn colt, knows how to walk.
"People derive their morality from a combination of reason and empathy"
There you go sneaking empathy into the equation again. Who died and made empathy king? Sympathy is an emotion and if it must inform reason then reason is no longer a sufficient basis for determining morality. Neo is quite correct, there is simply no way in a Godless universe to move from "WHAT IS" to "WHAT SHOULD BE". De Sade's pronouncement; "WHAT IS, IS RIGHT" is where logic without emotion leads.
"People can also derive principles from the subjective field of the supernatural, the imagined, etc. But there is no guarantee these principles will have any moral value, especially given their arbitrary nature--and in consideration of their logical detachment from the objective world."
Are emotions not subject to the same charge of arbitrariness? Certainly they must be.
"The people I quoted, however, worshiped non existent (FALSE) gods. "
"None of these people worshipped God....... The principles arose independently out of their own heathen brains,"
That's actually fallacious reasoning, in that one does not establish a causal connection to the other. Even if it were, I fail to see how that helps you. If you say they arrived at their conclusions through superstition then you can't claim them as also establishing your position through reason alone.
"I have demonstrated for you, that none of these people who possess what you admit is a moral principle--that none of these people got that moral principle from God."
Not even close. Rather, I have shown that they acted in a manner consistent with the biblical teaching. You're trying to sneak by, using emotion and the arguments of Theists which you have admitted are illogical and unreasonable, in a failed attempt to establish logic and reason as a sufficient basis for morals.
"You don't seem to be able to understand that non Christians and the non religious are simply CHOCK FULL of morality!"
That point was never the issue. I have always granted it freely, so it is a hollow victory indeed, if that's what your trying to establish. What I have been asking from the start was
Given the assumptions of moral relativism, is pedophilia objectively wrong????
It seems you are somewhat conflicted on this, one minute you say no , the next you are trying to prove that the one two punch of reason and emotion are enough to allow for objective morality. Which is it going to be today?
"Do you know not the wrath of God for breaking His most cherished commandments? You need to get down on your knees and say a long heartfelt prayer--"
Yes I do know about God's wrath and you are standing under it. Praying for the dead is not part of my Theology, but I will continue to pray for you. |
