hmaly, RE: "Amy Re... It's a much better option to be bussed for an extra hour to a better school. I have no idea why you think bussing on average, get you to a better school. Sure some kids in the poor side of town go to a nicer looking school. However, that is countered by the kid being bussed back into the poorer school. What about him?"
My 8th grade math was redundant. I should have been bussed to high school. Here's another example, everyone knows San Jose schools are generally poor, while PA, Cupertino and Saratoga have better schools. Don't see why motivated students can't be bussed to the better schools.
RE: "Secondly, it is much faster, and cheaper to just wire the money, into the poorer districts, through a federal aid program, or property income tax redistribution."
No amount of additional money would have gotten my 8th grade math class into a more competitive situation, other than a complete revamp of the system. Throwing more money at a bad system, isn't teh answer.
RE: "Thirdly, the kids hate the long ride on the bus, and really miss their friends when they get there."
I would absolutely loved the opportunity to be bussed to the high school for a more competitive course. Anyone who is serious about their studies, would be. And they shouldn't be denied such an opportunity. Why create artificial barriers to motivated students?
RE: "Then when these minority students form a gang, to protect themselves, against the crowd, you sit there and wonder what happened. I think a lot of the violence increase comes from the increase of gangs in school."
You switched the topic of bussing, to gangs. I was talking about the bussing of students extremely interested in getting the best education. If someone misbehaves 3Xs, then they shouldn't be bussed.
RE: " quotas" Without proper representation, industries can lose their customer mindshare overnight. School is a place of learning, not a business."
School is the pipeline for businesses, governments and non-profits. How many students do you know that can retire immediately out of school? This implies school is for giving students a good career in some type of occupation. The only new thing is, students need to be ready for global competition in a global workforce.
RE: " Just how do you propose to do that; have each teacher bring an Uzi into class. "
Why are students so violent these days? They certainly weren't that bad when I was going to school.
RE: " They don't have lock downs, hall monitors or any other type of security in college, yet there haven't been any shootings at any major college. Why not. "
Probably because the troubled ones don't go on to college. So statistically, there's less problems in college compared to lower schools.
RE: "If a student refuses, to behave himself in class, get rid of him. If a student brings in a gun or knife, get rid of him, and let his parents find him another place, like the Marines maybe. There he can play with a gun to his hearts content."
That's probably a really good idea. I'm not into war, but I've heard the Marines can be a good environment for giving people really good structure and discipline.
I think your suggestion is really creative and as long as they aren't forced to fight in a war when they are underage and as long as an employer (or the student) can pay the Marines a fee so the student is free to go, I think it's an absolutely excellent idea.
RE: " If they change their mind, on their career choice, and decide they want to go to college, what have they lost? All they have to do is take some remedial classes. "
They've lost a lot of time and money.
RE: " It is how you treat the students, and how motivated they are. Quit treating them like babies, let them take responsibility for their own lives earlier than college; and maybe they will respond just as our college students have."
I agree. People tend to behave according to expectations. If expectations aren't high in society, the behavior won't be.
RE: " You are missing my point. The smartest students in China, India etc, likely get tens, if not hundreds of scholarships from colleges all around the world."
They don't. I know a lot of the top folks from both countries (within top 1 thru 500). Many can't afford to apply for more than one or two schools, 3 at most. So on average, probably only one or two. These are people with GRE scores of 99%.
RE: " Therefore, if the system our teachers are taught to use when teaching is world class in college; why isn't it working in high school? I say it is the system, not the teachers. That is why the high school system should be junked, and changed to a college type system. Then maybe our high school students will be world class also."
I agree with this. I think the high school should be changed into a college-like environment - make it more competitive. Though, I do believe university professors are way more competitive than high school teachers and also believe not enough teachers have a grasp of math and science. My 8th grade math teacher didn't know math as well as some of his students. We don't have a good supply of teachers for math, so we should start importing them from India or Asia.
RE: "And I say the foreign students are looking for that creativity edge our students have."
Most foreign students don't even know we're creative here, until they get here. They're here to study. Most are here for survival - i.e. they need to go to the best schools to get a good job.
RE: "When I was in college, I knew several students from Taiwan... they didn't need to work themselves through college."
That's an edge the overseas people have over the USA, when they attend college in the USA it's generally only the American students that work in college. ( In grad school, both work - RA, TA, PA. )
Nearly ditto for high school - in the Bay Area, it seems like none of the Asian or Indian immigrant children hold jobs, but the white or Latino kids in San Jose have to hold a highschool job.
Working cuts into studies. I started working at age 12 to save up for college, and sometimes worked until 3AM on a Sunday night - of course it cuts into the studies.
RE: " Of course, when they graduated, they were expected to go back to Taiwan, and work there."
Really? Why? None of my Taiwanese college roommates went back home. In some cases, their parents moved here.
But these days, there are significantly less coming here. Why is that? What's wrong?
RE: "The point is that those students could have picked the best college in any country. Why here? Because we generally have the best"
Agreed. They come for the best schools and best professors in teh world.
Unfortunately, we're not letting hardly any foreign grad students into this country, so the supply of professors is probably going to drop big times. Not even the foreign professors are able to get into this country so easily - huge article on this I think in Scientific American.
I'm trying to get an engineering student into the USA so she can attend grad school here - good luck they say because she's a female! I asked, what does her gender have anything to do with this? Immigration policies strongly frowns upon letting a female engineering student into the country, which is really too bad, because we have so few women in engineering. It's much easier getting a male into this country, than a female due to our immigration policies. It's ridiculous when you consider we only have 1% or 3% of women professors in engineering.
RE: "Think about it. How much money is wasted bussing students, which could be better spent upgrading the poor schools. "
I guarantee you that throwing money at my 8th grade school would never have fixed the problem. It's like throwing money at a bad company. You don't.
RE: "Quotas are needed in schools, so industries don't go downhill due to a lack of representation of the consumer base they represent. You have said this several times, but I don't have a clue how bussing widens a businesses consumer base"
I didn't associate quotas to bussing.
We need quotas to ensure diversity in the pipeline.
Regards,
Amy J |
