><>...Hi Ron...><> Thank you for clearing up WE...
I am very familiar with the Hebrew rendering of the word Elohim as it is used in Gen.1:26
Gen 1:26
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
430 God, Strongs= 'elohiym (el-o-heem');
plural of 433; gods in the ordinary sense; but specifically used (in the plural thus, especially with the article) of the supreme God; occasionally applied by way of deference to magistrates; and sometimes as a superlative:
KJV-- angels, X exceeding, God (gods)- dess, -ly), X (very) great, judges, X mighty.
I have no problem with this. God in Gen.1:26 was in fact speaking to the angels, but He was not asking them to help Him with the creation of Earth as you stated. Your statement was that God was just a supervisor while other entities actually did the creating, and you attempted to show that by using the word we as you said was in scripture. There is no we used in that verse. So without saying that you were wrong I just wanted you to show me where you wer getting it from. I suspected all along that you were referring to the us
Gen 1:26
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
#6213 Us, Strongs = 'asah (aw-saw');
a primitive root; to do or make, in the broadest sense and widest application (as follows):
KJV-- accomplish, advance, appoint, apt, be at, become, bear, bestow, bring forth, bruise, be busy, X certainly, have the charge of, commit, deal (with), deck, + displease, do, (ready) dress (-ed), (put in) execute (-ion), exercise, fashion, + feast, [fighting-] man, + finish, fit, fly, follow, fulfill, furnish, gather, get, go about, govern, grant, great, + hinder, hold ([a feast]), X indeed, + be industrious, + journey, keep, labour, maintain, make, be meet, observe, be occupied, offer, + officer, pare, bring (come) to pass, perform, pracise, prepare, procure, provide, put, requite, X sacrifice, serve, set, shew, X sin, spend, X surely, take, X thoroughly, trim, X very, + vex, be [warr-] ior, work (-man), yield, use.
It is quite different from the english rendering. And it is quite a study in and of itself. If you are interested in it then do a study on the word make.
Example: Tower of Babble
Gen 11:4
4 And they said, Go to, let us build us a city and a tower, whose top may reach unto heaven; and let us make us a name, lest we be scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth.
6213 'asah (aw-saw');
a primitive root; to do or make, in the broadest sense and widest application (as follows): Same as Above
Getting back to the issue That God Supervised while some other entity created the earth is just noy written, however, it is written that God said Let us make man in our image. And in this scripture when we understand that God in this scripture, is translated from the Hebrew word Elohim, "Let us make" man....becomes much clearer.
In any case Ron the above issue is not of great importance. We don't even have to understand it. What is of supreme importance is that Jesus is our Lord and Savior, and that we believe that He came, suffered, died, and was resurrected for the sins of the world.
You said Ron:
>>>"I am just a tired old man looking
for the truth and those that see it also. It has been along time since I have
pulled out the good book and had to prove what I say.">>>
Maybe it is time to pull it out again, For therin lies the truth you say that you are looking for.... I am speaking of the Bible the only true word of God.
TRINITY
The coexistence of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit in the unity of the Godhead (divine nature or essence). The doctrine of the trinity means that within the being and activity of the one God there are three distinct persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Although the word trinity does not appear in the Bible, the "trinitarian formula" is mentioned in the Great Commission <Matt. 28:19> and in the benediction of the apostle Paul's Second Epistle to the Corinthians <2 Cor. 13:14>.
God revealed Himself as one to the Israelites: "Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one!" <Deut. 6:4>. This was a significant religious truth because the surrounding nations worshiped many Gods and had fallen into idolatry, worshiping the creation rather than the true Creator <Rom. 1:18-25>. "But when the fullness of the time had come," Paul wrote <Gal. 4:4>, "God sent forth His Son, born of a woman, born under the law." In the New Testament God revealed that He is not only one but a family of persons-- an eternal, inexhaustible, and dynamic triune family of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, who are one in will and purpose, love and righteousness.
The relationship of Father and Son is prominent in the gospels because Jesus, the eternal Son who takes on human flesh, is most visible to us as He strikes a responsive chord through the Father-Son relationship. All the while the Holy Spirit is in the background, serving as our eyes of faith. The unity of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit is portrayed by Jesus' trinitarian teaching <John 14--16>. This truth is expressed in the total ministry of Jesus as recorded in all four gospels as well as in the rest of the New Testament. The triune family cooperates as one in bringing the lost person home again into a redeemed family of believers.
The most distinctive characteristic of the persons of the triune family is their selfless love for one another. Each esteems and defers to the other in a way that makes the original family of the trinity a model for the Christian family of believers in the church.
The Father gives all authority to the Son and bears witness to Him, as does Jesus to Himself <John 8:18>. Yet the Son claims nothing for Himself; He gives all glory to the Father who has sent Him <John 12:49-50>. The key to unlocking the mystery of the trinity is to observe how the persons of the triune family give themselves to one another in selfless love. They are always at one another's disposal.
The Father serves the Son; the Son serves the Father; Father and Son defer to the Holy Spirit, who in turn, serves and defers to the Father and Son in a oneness that is eternally dynamic and inexhaustible. The mutual love of the triune persons spills over into the creation and is seen in their generous cooperation in saving the lost <John 14:15-17,25-26>.
Since God is the original family-in-unity, so Christians are urged by Jesus and the apostles to imitate the divine family in the believing fellowship, as Jesus taught so clearly when He washed the disciples' feet <John 13:14-15>. The principal trait of the triune family is speaking the truth in love; this encourages a spirit of generosity among Christians as they reflect the divine family in calling the lost to come home.
The trinity was at work in the incarnation of Jesus, the Son of the Most High, as He was conceived in the womb of Mary by the power of the Holy Spirit <Luke 1:30-35>. At His baptism Jesus the Son received approval from the Father in the presence of the Holy Spirit <Luke 3:21-22>, fulfilling two Old Testament prophetic passages <Ps. 2:7; Is. 42:1>. The trinity was also present in the temptation, as Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, was led by the Spirit for 40 days in the wilderness. The devil recognized Jesus as the Son of God <Luke 4:3>, but he tried to destroy the faithful relationship of the divine family.
In His preaching in the synagogue at Nazareth Jesus fulfilled <Isaiah 61:1-2>, claiming that "the Spirit of the Lord is upon Me" <Luke 4:18> and indicating that the triune family was at work in Him as the servant Son. At the transfiguration, the voice of the Father spoke again in approval of Jesus the Son to the innermost circle of disciples <Luke 9:35>.
Jesus rejoiced in the Holy Spirit and in the Father who had delivered all things to the Son <Luke 10:21-22>. He claimed to be acting in the place of God and through the power of the Holy Spirit, who is the "finger" of God <Matt. 12:28, Luke 11:20>. Jesus' cleansing of the Temple was a claim of identification with the house of God His Father <Luke 19:45-46> that paralleled His concern for being in His Father's house at a much younger age <Luke 2:41-51>.
Jesus witnessed further to His authority as He sent forth the disciples, following His resurrection, with the words, "Behold, I send the promise of My Father upon you" <Luke 24:49>. He also told them to wait until they were empowered by the Holy Spirit <Acts 1:5,8>. Jesus claimed His Sonship not only from David but from David's Lord <Matt. 22:42-45>, indicating His deity.
Following His resurrection, Jesus sent the disciples to baptize "in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit" <Matt. 28:19>. The fulfillment of Jesus' prophecy as spokesman for the Father and the Holy Spirit <Acts 1:4-8> occurred at Pentecost. This continued throughout the Book of Acts when the Holy Spirit inspired Peter and the apostles to preach a trinitarian gospel of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit <Acts 2:32-33; 5:29-32; 10:38>.
Paul wrote from a sense of the triune family in Galatians, speaking often of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit <Gal. 3:13-14; 4:6; 5:5-6,22-24>. In Romans he used a threefold, trinitarian pattern to describe the plan of salvation <Rom. 1:18--3:20; 3:21--8:1; 8:2-30>. All the remaining New Testament books contain trinity teaching except James and 3 John.
The triune family is God's revelation of Himself as the ultimate truth about reality. This family is the original pattern from which God creates all the families of earth with their unity and diversity. The family of mankind, after losing its intimate relationship with the divine family at the Fall, is restored to fellowship by God's action. This happens when its members acknowledge the generosity originating in the Father, expressed by the Son, and energized by the Holy Spirit.
(from Nelson's Illustrated Bible Dictionary)
(Copyright (C) 1986, Thomas Nelson Publishers)
Have a good day Ron.
Shalom....><>
BTW...Not only is Jesus God but He is Alive |
