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Strategies & Market Trends : 2026 TeoTwawKi ... 2032 Darkest Interregnum
GLD 458.00+1.4%Jan 23 4:00 PM EST
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Hawkmoon
To: Hawkmoon who wrote (106932)8/8/2014 12:17:06 PM
From: Haim R. Branisteanu1 Recommendation   of 219761
 
As you I am suspicious of the story but if you will speak to veteran Russians they will not dismiss it out of hand at ALL, and based on their own knowledge it is very possible, based on how Russian acted in the past murdering millions of their own people to enhance their ruling and political positions.

History is on their side (meaning that it may be a true description of intentions) starting with the Oprichnina of Ivan Grozny.

1. Indeed there are two location called Pervomais'kyi one in the vicinity of Torez and Snizhne and one Pervomais'ke just west of Donetsk airport between Pisky and Netailove which control was disputable at best and I think was under Pro - Russian control.
2. The first version released by the Kremlin was that the Ukrainians shot down the plane with a Buck missile from a launch site just west of Donetsk
3. Further the Kremlin claimed that the Ukrainian tried to shut down the airplane that Putin was traveling with.
4. Only after the US provided intelligence information and photographs did the Russian started to change the story
5. The EU was not inclined to engage in sanction of Russia only after MH17 was shot down and they realized that the Pro Russians are messing around with the evidence on the ground and probably receiving hard evidence that indeed the plane was shut down from a battery near Torez, did they started to take the sanction seriously.

OK until now the facts

As to what I was told by Russian and others familiar with the Stalinist regime mentioning some unrelated facts of human sacrifice for the sake of the Stalinist regime.
1. The hate between so called Ukrainians and ethnic Russian is huge and dates back in recent history to the Bolshevik revolution where the Russian Bolsheviks not only deported the locals but also slaughtered them to have firm control of Nova Rassia which was conquered by a ethnic Prussian Empress Catherine the Great including the annexation of Crimea and what was called at the time Yedisan (now part of Ukraine).
2. To make room for ethnic Russians and destroy the resistance to the communist order Stalin ordered the Holodomor holodomorct.org defined by the Ukrainians as a deliberate Act of Genocide.
3. The empty settlements as a result of the Holodomor where settled by Stalin with ethnic Russian and from there the territorial claims of Russia for parts of Ukraine.
4.Remember the Russian first killed millions of Ukrainians and then resettled ethnic Russians in the empty agrarian settlements. (it is worthwhile to read more about this horrible event) Similar tactics where used in the Baltic States and part of Poland that they annexed including also parts of Romania along the Dniester River.
5. Fact is that most of the POW including ethnic Russian from WWII were send to re-education hard labor camps in Siberia submitted to horrible hardship beatings and even executions, for the reason that as a soldier or officer in the Red Army did not fight to their death.
6. With each Red Army unit a NKVD officials was assigned en.wikipedia.org units were used for rear area security, including the deterrence of desertion through Stalin's Order No. 270 and Order No. 227 decrees in 1941 and 1942, which aimed to raise troop morale via brutality and coercion, and in actuality shooting their own soldiers when retreating.
7.In liberated territory the NKVD and (later) NKGB carried out mass arrests, deportations, and executions. The targets included both collaborators with Germany and non-Communist resistance movements which included ethnic Russian Partisans and of course Jewish Partisans many who fled to today Israel

Therefore the claim is totally plausible IMHO and I trust the sources I spoke with (Russians that left Russia 10 13 years ago) as this is a very rational possibility by Russian Stalinist standards. It makes sense that is was an act of desperation of losing Crimea, and which loss may actually bring about the toppling of Putin from power which rumors started to circulate in Russia and other former Soviet Republics.

It is for you to decide if the story is true or not, and the most plausible fact is the duality of the location names and the first story disseminated by the Kremlin - and now the irrational stubbornness of those in political power within the Kremlin

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