So when you combine 1 and 2 you get to where we are now on SI- sewers or Balkan states.
I remember what you remember. I remember when Sharks was renamed Sharks and why. I remember discussing it with you. But I also remember the good stuff. Not claiming it could be replicated now, just bemoaning the loss.
I had been meaning for some time to go back to the discussion of the thought experiment re the masseur who wanted to limit his clientele to straight men. Remember that? The current issue re baking wedding cakes for gay weddings made me think of it. Since I don't now have anyone with whom to bounce around ideas like that and clarify my position, I thought that what folks had to say back then about the masseur might inform my thinking on the current issue. I was also curious what my position was back then and why. My recollection of the arguments was vague. I had tried finding that discussion before but gave up. (It's been bugging me for some time that I can't recall the name of the masseur--something like Mojo, maybe. Do you recall?)
Anyway, I found it. Started here: Message 19291931. Ten years ago. Thread was busy at the time. I've barely gotten through a day's worth. I found a lot of thoughts worth clipping. And no nonsense so far...
From this thread earlier today:
This thread is a perfect example of an educated populace. And we don't get fooled very often here because everyone here has spent their life trying to understand and doing what it is necessary to achieve that. And we check each others ideas. If one is checking one's ideas for conformity with one's in-group lest one commit a faux pas, then that works. If one is checking one's ideas for validity and robustness, however, it's necessary to vet them with folks who will provide at least thoughtful if not constructive criticism. If you vet with just your in-group, the confirmation bias and shared sources won't get you there. It takes someone who has a different perspective to spot the flaws. For me, I like to have positions I can proudly back up, not necessarily positions that will cement my position in the group. You can't validate your positions in an echo chamber. I read so many notions that clearly never had constructive criticism and some of them unfortunately get implemented.
I gained a lot from those old discussions. One of the things I learned some two decades back was about cultural bubbles. I recall the first time I posted something like "well, everyone thinks that" because everyone around me thought that, or "that's just not done," only to find out that other people with different perceptions of what people think also believed that the view that surrounded them was standard and that what "we" just didn't do might be SOP for others. Who knew? I didn't. Until I found out on SI. Valuable lesson.
Alas, as you say, constructive input from varying perspectives is a thing of the past.
In reading about the masseur, I have gotten to posts from Neo but not yet Rambi. Much more lost than just a forum for discussion. |
