Shalom, Mr Pharisee, satan cast out of heaven in Rev. 12:1-12. See below explanation.
My answer, The Holy Spirit enlightened me as I studied The Bible comparing verse to
verse and book to book.
1. You wrote,
"><>...Rose... After Jesus was resurrected?... Who has told you that?"
My answer,
What a nasty little implication you have made. As though I got it from some human(see
above). Are you judging me by what you do?
To me, Rev 12:1- 12 symbolicly describes satan being cast out of heaven.
12:1 The woman is a symbol(sign) for national Israel based on Gen 37:5-10. Jacob is the
sun, his wife(s) are the moon, the stars are his 12 sons. This is a symbol(sign) for
Israel, the nation.
12:2 she(nation in the female gendure) was with child(Messiah). Her major purpose was
that God would deliver The Messiah through her. She struggled, but
succeeded.
12:3 another sign, fiery red dragon(satan, 12:9), seven heads, ten horns, seven diadems.
This is a sign of satan working thru the Roman empire(seven hills of Rome)
12:4 his tail drew 1/3 of the stars from heaven- Romans killed some of the sons of
Israel(Jews). Dragon stood before woman(national Israel) who was ready to give
birth(Gal. 4:4), in order to kill her child - satan working thru the Roman empire,
specifically Herod, to kill Jesus.(Mat 2:12,13)
12:5 she(nation) bore a male child who was to rule all nations - the birth of
Jesus(Messiah), her child was caught up to God and His throne(Heb 12:2.....and
has taken his seat at the right hand of the throne of God.). Time span
showing the birth and resurrection of Jesus, His return to The Father.
12:6 woman fled into the wilderness- the Jewish people(Israel) scatter into world for
protection and survival.
12:7 war broke out in heaven - Michael and his angels fought with the dragon(satan), the
dragon and his angels faught
12:8 they didn't prevail, nor was a place found for them anymore in heaven.
12:9 so the great dragon was cast out. that old serpent, called the devil and satan,
who deceives(at time of writing) the whole world. cast to the earth, his angels with
him.
12:10 declaration of salvation(after atonement) and strength, the kingdom of our God and
His christ have come(Jesus is now on his throne Heb. 10:12) the accuser of our
brethern, who accused them night and day before God, has been cast down.
12:11 they overcame him by the blood of The Lamb and by the word of their
testimony.
12:12 therefore rejoice(present tense) o heavens, and you who dwell in them! woe to the
inhabitants of the earth and the sea! For the devil has come down to you, having great
wrath, because he knows his time is short.
2. You asked, "Have you not read Ez.28 Is.14 just to mention a few?"
Answer, yes.
3. You said, "Rev.12:7 rose, has yet to happen....I am afraid that you have gotten some
scriptures ahead of the horse.....Read on rose in 12:12...if you believe that Rev.12:7 has
already happened you will be quite deceived when it does come to pass..."
Answer, Since you addressed me, I believe it has happened as described above. I was
stating my understanding of the Scriptures as God gave it to me. Now you say I received
it from God in error. It is my personal opinion that you need to take a closer look at
yourself. You may be the one who is deceived. Have you ever been wrong about
anything? What makes you think you are correct and others are wrong? Are you the only
one who can have an understanding of The Bible?
4. You wrote, "And rose as Steve has told you, I also tell you....what you believe
concerning the creation of our Father moves me not....but just know this.....it is you who
is being deceived by man and his traditions...look around you listen to truth...how can you
or anyone else deny what God has broght forth millions of yrs. ago?... the word of God,
when taken precept by precept cannot be altered to fit any mans traditions.... A blid man
knows this world is not just 7000 yrs old...."
Answer, nowhere in any of my post did I say what you imply. You should read more
closely and not interject preconceived notions into the things I write. In fact, I believe
quite the contrary, that the physical world is about 4 billion years old and the universe
about 12-14 billion, give or take a few billion, not important. God did it.
5. You wrote, " But if you are set on some false teachings of the church, well then so be
it.....my hands are clean....
It is certainly not something to divide over and certainly not something that can be taught
in this forum,it take hrs. of pure honest study in the word of God "SOLELY" within the
word of God...."God's Plan for Man" is a good start for those who are completely in the
dark concerning this truth.Dake uses Scripture to prove scripture, it is not always the style
of Dake....but in this case it is..There is no one, once they understand the 3 world
ages,(and the various dispensations as they do relate to one another) that can honestly
believe that this world is only 7000 yrs. old....NO way!!!.The truths of God are ever so
deep, they can't all be found by skimming the surface...."
Answer, you sure make a lot of judgmental decisions about my understanding, length and
depth of my study. In what post did I ever mention a church? How can you judge that
which you don not know? For your information, not that I like to mention it, but I have
been studying the Bible for 50+ years. I try not to speculate or read into Scripture things
that are not there. I cross reference verse to verse and compare ideas and concepts from
from book to book. That's how the Lord led me to associate Gen 37 with Rev. 12.
I haven't criticized your understanding of the scriptures, nor in anyway degraded them.
That is not my job, as I recall, that belongs to Christ. I simply don't believe the things you
do and I am stating what God has given me to believe over the years. If you don't agree
with them, fine. On the other hand, you have belittled me and presented yourself as some
sort of a superior mind, all knowledgeable in the scriptures. If someone has a different
understanding than yours, you present the idea that they are wrong and you are right.
This seems very similar to the way the Pharisees treated Jesus. You know how it was,
the lowly son of a carpenter cannot be the Messiah. And can you believe it, Jesus even
told a parable that made a hated Samaritan the hero. I wonder who He would choose to
make a hero in our day?
Since you wrote to me first, I will respond. I disagree with your idea about 3 world ages.
Number 1 cannot be, because God lives in eternity and 100 x 100 x 100 quadrillion years
ago, just to mention a short period of time, there was no world. Number 2 , this world is
going to be burned up and disolved(2 Pet 3:11, Therefore seeing all these things will be
disolved...). Number 3, the next world is not this world but a brand spanking new world
created by Jesus our Lord. Rev 21:1 Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth; for the
first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and the sea was no more. Rev 21:5
And the one who was seated on the throne said, "See, I am making all things new." Also
he said, "Write this, for these words are trustworthy and true."
6. You wrote,
"Shalom...><>
PS...Sorry rose but if I must tell you how evolution dishonors our Father....well then,
maybe we are not at all alike."
My answer, your attitude is absolutely amazing, this is a perfect example of that which I
was referring to above. You don't need to tell me anything. It was simply a rhetorical
question. You jumped to conclusions and assumed I was defending evolution. I neither
defend or disapprove of it. What I do believe is this, GOD DID IT, HE CREATED
MAN. Makes no difference to me how! You see, I give God credit for creating all things,
for moving upon the face of the earth to bring about the fulfillment of His will. I'm certain
I don't know the total of His will, nor how He will ultimately accomplish it. Two things I
do know. You don't know it either, and , for certain I know, " 2 Tim 1:12 .... for I know
whom I have believed and I am convinced that He is able to guard what I have entrusted
to Him until that day."
Jesus loves us! |
