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Non-Tech : Datek Brokerage $9.95 a trade -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: David Kuspa who wrote (12486)	6/14/1999 5:02:00 PM
From: RockyBalboa	Respond to of 16892

Their rep says that the market makers have to get their spread. Is this accurate? No, they lie. The "manning" rules state that, in the case, the MM does not close the trade inhouse, he has to update his own quote, hence, show 6 1/4. So he either shows 6 1/4 or takes your pieces on his nostro. This is real shitty. What happens when I try that via Datek? The order is either SNET out to MMs (if it is a marketable order, only), or put on ISLD, and ISLD, if your bid makes the best bid, is presented along with the MMs on L II. I think you may ask Fidelity to make good on the trade at 6 1/4. It appears the time you mentioned was between 15:14:38 and 15:43:21, today, no? Good Guys Inc, Time/Sales - QCharts c1999 Quote.com 06/14/99 23:11:06 Index Date Time Price Size Exchange BATE Indicator -11 06/14/99 15:57:07 6 1/4 600 nasd Best ask Downtick -12 06/14/99 15:57:06 6 3/16 1,000 nasd Trade -13 06/14/99 15:57:02 6 3/16 2,400 nasd Trade -14 06/14/99 15:57:00 6 7/32 1,500 nasd Trade -15 06/14/99 15:55:22 6 7/32 100 nasd Trade -16 06/14/99 15:54:16 6 7/32 1,500 nasd Best ask Downtick -17 06/14/99 15:53:30 6 1/4 300 nasd Trade -18 06/14/99 15:51:17 6 3/16 1,000 nasd Trade -19 06/14/99 15:51:05 6 3/16 3,400 nasd Cancel -20 06/14/99 15:50:26 6 3/16 3,400 nasd -21 06/14/99 15:49:12 6 1/4 1,000 nasd Best ask Downtick -22 06/14/99 15:48:23 6 3/16 500 nasd Trade -23 06/14/99 15:47:56 6 3/16 200 nasd Trade -24 06/14/99 15:43:49 6 1/4 900 nasd Best ask Downtick -25 06/14/99 15:43:24 6 5/16 300 nasd Trade -26 06/14/99 15:43:21 6 1/4 1,000 nasd Best ask Downtick -27 06/14/99 15:41:34 6 1/4 3,000 nasd Trade -28 06/14/99 15:40:38 6 3/16 100 nasd Trade -29 06/14/99 15:40:38 6 3/16 900 nasd Best bid Downtick -30 06/14/99 15:39:02 6 3/16 1,000 nasd Best bid Downtick -31 06/14/99 15:39:02 6 3/16 500 nasd Trade -32 06/14/99 15:37:52 6 3/16 1,500 nasd Trade -33 06/14/99 15:30:09 6 3/16 1,000 nasd Trade -34 06/14/99 15:29:17 6 5/16 1,500 nasd Best ask Downtick -35 06/14/99 15:21:07 6 5/16 1,000 nasd Trade -36 06/14/99 15:20:14 6 3/16 200 nasd Trade -37 06/14/99 15:15:32 6 5/16 2,000 nasd Trade -38 06/14/99 15:15:13 6 9/32 5,000 nasd Trade -39 06/14/99 15:14:38 6 5/16 100 nasd Best ask Downtick -40 06/14/99 15:14:37 6 1/4 1,700 nasd Trade -41 06/14/99 15:14:36 6 1/4 1,700 nasd Trade -42 06/14/99 15:14:15 6 1/4 100 nasd Trade -43 06/14/99 15:14:13 6 1/4 100 nasd Trade -44 06/14/99 15:14:10 6 1/4 200 nasd Trade -45 06/14/99 15:14:00 6 7/32 2,500 nasd Trade -46 06/14/99 15:13:36 6 3/16 500 nasd Best bid Downtick -47 06/14/99 15:13:28 6 3/16 800 nasd Trade -48 06/14/99 15:13:28 6 3/16 800 nasd Trade -49 06/14/99 15:13:22 6 1/4 1,700 nasd Best ask Downtick -50 06/14/99 15:13:15 6 7/32 2,500 nasd Trade

To: David Kuspa who wrote (12486)	6/14/1999 5:15:00 PM
From: Sir Francis Drake	Respond to of 16892

David - Fidelity is full of it with their explanation. The MM is obliged to execute you, or adjust their quote within 17 seconds. So, wrong, on the explanation and quote display (unless it all happened inside of 17 seconds). Should you have been executed? It all depends on what happened. It is possible that no MM wanted to hit you, at your price. As to the higher quote trade, it could have happened because it could have been an ECN, and so somebody took it out and what you saw was just the T&S, but you were bypassed - nothing illegal in that. I don't understand though why you weren't shown as the inside ask. Morgan

To: David Kuspa who wrote (12486)	6/14/1999 5:16:00 PM
From: JCinTC	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 16892

David, nasdr.com "The Limit Order Display Rule The first of the new rules concerns limit orders, which are orders to buy or sell a designated number of shares of a security at a specific price. Previously, investors could place limit orders, but the prices of investors' limit orders were not routinely displayed in a Market Maker's quotes. Now, under the Limit Order Display Rule, a Market Maker that receives a limit order priced better than its best current quote must display the investor's limit order price and size on the trading screen as the Best Bid or Ask. If a limit order is priced the same as the Market Maker's quote, the Market Maker must reflect the size of the customer's order in its quote. The investor's limit order can now be seen by the entire marketplace, giving it greater visibility, and therefore a greater likelihood that it will be executed quickly. Certain types of orders are exempt from the rules: 1) all-or-none orders (an order that must receive one execution in its entirety); 2) orders that customers request not be displayed; 3) orders of fewer than 100 shares; and 4) orders of greater than 10,000 shares or totaling more than $200,000 in market value" JC

To: David Kuspa who wrote (12486)	6/14/1999 5:25:00 PM
From: Jim S	Respond to of 16892

Welcome to Fido, David! They really hate this online trading stuff, because it allows customers to see how they operate. InfoStream and the others gave you the right answer to your question, but it is only part of the story. Fido uses their own marketmaker (Asset Management Corp, or something like that), and virtually never uses SOES. So, they still play the same games all brokers and MMs used to play in manipulating prices and skimming spreads. You can fuss at them till you turn blue, and they probably won't give you the trade at your limit price. Even if you could gather the info to prove they didn't handle your order properly, they would be unlikely to give you the trade (except out of kindness) because it would impact how they do business; they know they can outspend you for legal expenses if you choose to make a fuss. They make far too much money in their (IMO) dishonest procedures and (IMO) cheating ways to ever allow a single customer to change their business model. BTW, did you know their brokers don't get paid commissions? They are all salaried. Don't you think they make up the difference in labor costs somehow? IMO, Fido does fine with fairly active stocks that they can't hide under their protective cloak. For slower moving issues, though, you might want to consider a more automated broker like Datek. good luck, jim

To: David Kuspa who wrote (12486)	6/14/1999 9:48:00 PM
From: gbh	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 16892

David, I have joined the best bid or best ask many times with Fidelity, and am almost always represented as such with the MM symbol NFSC. Sometimes I am represented with the symbol SHWD (I guess when Fido doesn't make the market themselves). The latest time I did this was today for SNRS. I joined the bid to buy 500 shares at 10 5/8. NFSC showed up on Level 2 about 10 seconds later, and I was filled maybe two minutes after that, while other MMs were still bidding. I've never had a limit order not represented, although it is 5 to 10 seconds slower than Datek. I should mention that my occasional market order at Fidelity usually fills instantly. gary