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To: Gauguin who wrote (30482)	6/30/1999 12:59:00 PM
From: Jacques Chitte	Respond to of 71178

>It's a complete mystery to me why people hassle with a creation myth in the first place. Or even a creation reality. They may both be equally irrelevant.< It is the ultimate manifestation of our Quest for Order. We are compelled (by our meat?) as individuals and societies to trace the logic back to its hindmost point. A Creator God does an excellent job of satisfying that deep neural itch to have the cosmos Taken Care Of. Perhaps a society of truly successful and contented secularists would have to be soy-based. Gardenofedenburger.

To: Gauguin who wrote (30482)	6/30/1999 1:24:00 PM
From: Ilaine	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 71178

This will probably piss you off, but Clavius (Jesuit) claimed that Galileo's observations did not prove his assertion that the Sun was the center of the solar system - and according to this sketch, Clavius was correct. sal.wisc.edu

To: Gauguin who wrote (30482)	7/2/1999 11:50:00 AM
From: JF Quinnelly	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 71178

It has always been a mystery to me why religions tend to seperate themselves from science. I know; you say they don't. Pierre Duhem discovered the scientific speculations and investigations of the Middle Ages while reading through the records of old monasteries and universities. No one had thought to investigate this aspect of intellectual history until he stumbled over it around 1900. Far from being against science these men were curious about nature and did a lot of the groundwork that led to modern science. Science was pushed forward by the likes of Philoponus, Jordanus, Buridan, Oresme. So tell us what DID happen to Galileo. And why. And the "non-simple" account, that clears the religious assholes of being religious assholes. I wasn't attempting to clear the Catholic church for censoring Galileo. I did point out that the Protestants of the same era fostered the science of Kepler and Copernicus. Do these Protestants also get included in your wider set of "religious assholes"? My other point was that the Vatican censors were getting their cosmology from Plato. <<<There is no philosophical conflict between science and religion, but it constantly gets invoked as A Great Truth. Most of the halfwits who parrot this>>> You're mixing three things willy nilly. Science, religion, and religious influence. Organizations. Churches. Culture. Inquisitions. Heresy. Theocracy. Fine. Then you can start holding the same standard to those who constantly shift between all three when making the opposite case. I just saw the Spanish Inquisition invoked as a proof that Christianity was hostile to science. Halfwits.