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Gold/Mining/Energy : SOFC vrs PEM Fuel Cells (Debate Forum) -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: CH4 who wrote (45)	7/9/1999 4:51:00 PM
From: Sleeperz	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 79

Crispy critters is not a stark reality. The passenger on the Hindenburg were not cooked by the burning hydrogen but the structure that caught on fire itself. Hey I'm am not denying the fact that compressed hydrogen is dangerous. All I am saying is that a compressed hydrogen tank is not similiar to the Hindenburg. I would say a compressed hydrogen tank if you want a more accurate comparison, would be with an Acetylene tank. Those acetylene tanks when they go , go with a BIG Bang. Yes, and once the balloon bursts, the pressure is no longer exerted in all directions. Watch a fire, see the flame, it rises up. Put your hand on top of the fire, to the sides, and the underside. Where would you feel more heat? Any gas exerts pressure in all directions. If this wasn't true your tire would be flat on one side. Try an experiment, take a kids balloon fill it full of pure hydrogen then place it above your stove element let it float up to the fan hood then turn your stove elements to simmer. Sort of correct. 3) Should be Oxygen. Most of the air is not used in combustion. Any fire requires only 3 things to work it is called a combustion triangle :- 1)Fuel...2)Source of Ignition...3)Air A gas does not explode. The tank will explode from the rapid combustion of the hydrogen. Just because the specific gravity of a gas is lighter than 1.0 that does not mean that when a gas explodes it only goes in one direction remember any gas exerts pressure in all directions. I do not deny the fact that compress H2 will not catch on fire. A small balloon filled with hydrogen will hardly do much damage since it is not under high pressure and the container is just rubber holding a small amount of H2. Seen it done it. It goes POP like a firecracker. I do not have any new fangled sensors. I do not want to even use a PEM FC, it needs pure H2 to run properly. Anything that is Pure is expensive. I prefer the SOFC myself. When a gas is compressed into a container you should be able to introduce a source of ignition into it and it won't catch on fire because the air part of the combustion triangle has been displaced from the container by the gas. Now go into the kitchen and stick a lit match into the balloon ... I hope your new fangled sensor can be wired to auto dial 911 and your phone doesn't melt because it's not made out of platinum.

To: CH4 who wrote (45)	7/19/1999 12:56:00 PM
From: Scoobah	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 79

Another PEM victory; this one with NYSE: IDA IdaCorp's Nortwest Power Systems biz.yahoo.com Monday July 19, 10:01 am Eastern Time Company Press Release SOURCE: Northwest Power Systems [Northwest Power Systems Buys DCH Technology Fuel Cell System] BEND, Ore., July 19 /PRNewswire/ -- Northwest Power Systems (NPS) today announced the purchase of a 3 kilowatt fuel cell system from DCH Technology (OTC Bulletin Board: DCHT - news) that will be integrated with NPS's patented fuel processor. The purchase is the most recent in a series made by NPS from a growing list of fuel cell manufacturers, including De Nora, S.p.A., Milan, Italy, with which NPS has a long-term fuel cell supply agreement. ''This purchase from DCH Technology is strategic to the integration of our proprietary fuel processor with fuel cells from as many different manufacturers as possible,'' said Alan Guggenheim, president of Northwest Power Systems. ''Our objective is to test approximately 25 small-scale, experimental prototype fuel cell systems the next 12 months, and more than 150 the next three years. We expect a dozen fuel cell manufacturers to participate in the program,'' he said. NPS's core technology is a patented fuel processor for generating pure hydrogen that a fuel cell needs to produce electricity. DCH Technology is manufacturing an integrated PEM (protonexchange-membrane) fuel cell system, incorporating a NPS fuel processor, designed to supply residential electricity, said Guggenheim. The unit will be similar to NPS systems, incorporating De Nora fuel cells, that have already been tested in a dozen northwest homes and businesses the past 12 months. NPS takes a ''systems'' approach to integrating its fuel processor with fuel cells from various manufacturers. NPS's objective is the commercialization of a variety of fuel cell products that will include models operating on methanol, ethanol, propane, diesel, kerosene, natural gas and other fuels. The DCH Technology unit will operate on methanol. NPS's fuel cell systems, rated 2.5 kilowatts to 3.5 kilowatts, are targeted for stationary and portable applications. NPS's largest customers for experimental prototype fuel processors and fully integrated fuel cell systems include the Bonneville Power Administration, an agency of the U.S. Department of Energy (DoE), and Sandia National Laboratories, a prime contractor to DoE. BPA will field-test NPS's fuel cell systems under a long-term, $3.5 million purchase order contract for delivery of 110 fuel cell units between 1999 and 2003. Founded in 1996, Northwest Power Systems is a subsidiary of IDACORP Technologies, Inc., Boise, Idaho, a non-regulated subsidiary of IDACORP, Inc. (NYSE: IDA - news). SOURCE: Northwest Power Systems