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Pastimes : Let's Talk About Our Feelings!!! -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Dayuhan who wrote (47043)	7/25/1999 11:27:00 AM
From: Michael M	Respond to of 108807

Ah, the rainy season. My first many visits to the PI were between July and September. Imagine my delight (and surprise) the first time I alighted on a gorgeous "winter" day. I believe, in reality, there are times when being a champion (in deed as well as word) of true democracy is not the wisest or even a sane course of action (incoming?). In fact, the version dreamt up by The Dead White Guys doesn't have a prayer in some cultures and situations. All governments of all kinds, IMO, are responsible for maintaining some degree of order. Chaos benefits no one. It may sound strange coming from a former(?) member of the "Kill-a-Commie-for-Christ crowd," but I've always marveled at the angst inspired by Tianimin (little hope of spelling that and too lazy to look it up) Square. Had the Chinese government/military not intervened harshly and decisively, I think the result would have been horrendous. In fact, I think the bodies would still be piling up. Martial Law, or something like it was the rule in the ROK for the longest time. Some good arguments can be made that it greatly benefited the Korean people. I could go on but I trust the limited reference above will serve to invite sufficient scorn. Although I have no shortage of opinions on Iran's modern history, I lack the personal knowledge and perspective to argue; only speculate. I do believe "the way" in which we walked (ran) away from the Shah was harmful to our interests and the stability of the mid east. I will stick to the opinion that we had no bankable idea what would happen if we abandoned Marcos before the 11th hour. Re. the possibility of giving Subic away on a silver platter, I rather think that, at the time, the U.S. would have "Guantanamized" it. As noted previously, the Navy literally had no place else to go and no intention of pulling back from the area. Some interesting parallels between Cuba and the PI, don't you think? As for the U.S. mission being horrified (and I trust they were), in my experience, most U.S. missions are either "horrified" or "snoozing" most of the time. I used the term "occupying" generically. Regardless of relations with the "host" country (in fact, even to a degree in the U.S.) large military garrisons frequently "occupy" their immediate surroundings. I suspect we are capable of agreeing on more things than we disagree on. I am going to try to back away from further specific discussion of the PI and RR's role there -- God bless them both.

To: Dayuhan who wrote (47043)	7/25/1999 1:15:00 PM
From: The Philosopher	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 108807

Change of topic. I finally came across a report on the environmental damage of our bombing of Yugoslavia. cgi.newsweek.com "A European Commission study has found that NATO's 11-week air war has left a legacy of poisoned water, radioactive air and potentially contaminated food in Serbia as well as some of its neighbors." "The effects of the bombing of [its] industrial facilities are a serious threat both locally and regionally to human health in the long-term." Fortuately, we did this 4,000 miles away, not in our own back yard, so we won't have to deal with it. And of course, as long as the Serbians continue to allow themselves to be ruled by a leader we disapprove of (we of course having the god-given right to dictate what leaders a country should have) we will refuse to offer any aid to repair the damage we did. Serves them right if we poisoned their air and water. Hooray for America.