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Pastimes : The Truth about Waco -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Machaon who wrote (35)	8/27/1999 10:57:00 AM
From: Merritt	Respond to of 1449

Barry, your note demonstrates, IMHO, a politically doctrinaire bias that disappoints me. When a person ignores the political excesses and misconduct of their "own" party, they do themselves and their country a disservice. Intellectual dishonesty may make a person seem clever at some cocktail parties, and within a narrow-minded group that shares your own particular bias, but it's corrosive to them in the long run.

To: Machaon who wrote (35)	8/27/1999 10:59:00 AM
From: long-gone	Respond to of 1449

COLUMN: VIN SUPRYNOWICZ Incendiary munitions found in Waco wreckage? </lvrj_home/help_about/rjstaff_email.html> Could it be that the fog of denial and obfuscation surrounding the deadly 1993 government tax raid on a Seventh Day Adventist church in Waco, Texas, are finally starting to clear? Rare is the radio show I do on this subject that isn't blessed with some government apologist calling in to insist the Rev. David Koresh did indeed possess automatic weapons at the Mount Carmel Church. Of course, the government promised to display such "captured machine guns" at the trial of the survivors in San Antonio, and never did. Nor do the government cronies like to admit that possessing such weapons is still perfectly legal in this country, upon payment of a mere $200 tax. Do most Americans endorse government taxmen with submachine guns firing on and incinerating dozens of innocent women and children in attempts to apprehend a preacher suspected of being $200 behind on his tax bills -- and doing so in massive armed raids organized to gain TV coverage a few weeks before their congressional funding hearings, even after the main subject of their investigation publicly invites said agents to drop by and inspect his weapons at any time? A great step forward in clearing the purposeful fog was the 1997 Academy Award-nominated documentary "Waco: The Rules of Engagement," which first brought to public attention infrared footage shot by a government plane circling high overhead on the day of the final fire, which claimed 80 souls as FBI agents purposely blocked fire engines from the scene." (cont) lvrj.com "The official version is undercut by BATF's concession that, when informed of the investigation, Koresh invited agents to come over, look at the firearms, and take any that they might feel were questionable. It is also undercut by a rather embarassing event. Thanks to the Freedom of Information Act, we now know how ATF undercover agents investigating the case spent February 19, 1993--nine days before the raid." indirect.com "Those who attack the government are not simply lawyers for the Branch Davidians or muckraking authors (although they are represented) but also solid middle-American types like the county sheriff, the district Texas Rangers, the FBI photographer on the scene, and the man who developed and patented some of the equipment used by the FBI itself to film devastating footage that appears to show its agents firing into the buildings--even though the FBI insists it did not fire a single shot. " cascadian.com Don't you get it, this was not about "protecting us", it was about getting additional funding for the FBI & ATF! Why do you think they called it "Showtime"? It not just us, those you call the "conservative fringe element", even the Texas Rangers say the FBI /ATF was wrong. You think they are also the "conservative fringe element"?

To: Machaon who wrote (35)	8/27/1999 11:26:00 AM
From: AI Master	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 1449

Oh come on Robert...you have to be joking?! People like you worry me! Many people think... Clinton is a criminal. Clinton is a felon. Clinton is a draft dodger. Clinton is a dope smoker. Clinton is a coke sniffer. Clinton is a rapist. Clinton is a tax cheat and land swindler. Clinton is a sexual harasser. Clinton is an adulterer. Clinton is a perjurer. Clinton is an obstructor of justice. Clinton is a murderer. Clinton may even have committed treason. Clinton is only president because he accepted illegal campaign contributions from Communists. Rocky

To: Machaon who wrote (35)	8/27/1999 12:16:00 PM
From: funk	Respond to of 1449

I just enjoyed reading this book : In the Spirit of Crazy Horse amazon.com by Peter Mathheissen Freedom is a myth. Having said that, I can also say, I wouldn't want to live anywhere else. Not even Canada !! haha have a great weekend, funk

To: Machaon who wrote (35)	8/27/1999 3:14:00 PM
From: long-gone	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 1449

Yes, Remember First she took full responsibility, now she places full blame: Reno's blues: Between Clinton and Gore, attorney general has tough rows to hoe By Mark Davis These must be tough days for U.S. Attorney General Janet Reno. The administration she serves is teetering on the brink of ruin. She is under intense pressure to launch a full-scale investigation of Vice President Al Gore. And her long-held image as tough and independent is in deep jeopardy. There is good reason. Frankly, someone arriving this week from Mars could see signs of Gore's blatant disregard for the proper line between official duties and campaign fund raising. The evidence of Clinton/Gore credit card calls from the Old Executive Office Building, the lame denial of a fund-raiser amid the Buddhist nuns, the clumsy excuses of "no controlling legal authority" -- all of this adds up to a smell that would be stifling if it were not next door to the waste treatment plant that President Clinton's life has become. Reno has now tiptoed toward the truth, launching another limited inquiry designed to determine whether a Ken Starr-style prosecutor is needed to examine the possibility of lawbreaking by Gore. Surely she must know that failure to open such an investigation will be the end of her credibility. That credibility has been attacked for most of her years as attorney general. She took responsibility for the disastrous events near Waco in 1993, mere weeks after she took office. Eighty people died, including 24 children, in the fire that consumed the Branch Davidians. Many Americans feel that justice could have been done without the escalation that led to the Mount Carmel carnage.(cont) star-telegram.net "Society in every state is a blessing, but Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil; in its worst state, an intolerable one." - Thomas Paine <paine.htm> (1737-1809), Anglo-American political theorist, writer. Common Sense, ch. 1 (1776). telecomputers.com

To: Machaon who wrote (35)	8/27/1999 9:06:00 PM
From: Gordon A. Langston	Respond to of 1449

Fringe Criminal Groups Robert, you have failed to identify the fringe criminal groups to which you refer and what makes them criminal let alone what the hell fringe means in this context. I have been closely following the responses of government officials in California regarding the recent shootings at a dayschool and I can't imagine a more hysterical bunch (including the press that reports their emotional rhetoric). Their complete disregard for the 2nd Amendment, logic and perspective only leave me believing that the fringe criminal groups you most likely refer to hold little danger to me compared to these fascist parasites. When's the last time some non-government entity threatened to take away or proposed to take away your constitutional rights?