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Pastimes : Jesus -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: PROLIFE who wrote (714)10/15/1999 9:59:00 AM
From: gregor  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 4775
 
Dear Dan:

There has been discussion here on contradictions or seeming contradictions in God's word concerning adherence to the law versis freedom from the law under grace. I wish to address that with a discussion on Romans Chap 9. For study purposes I will include that here for easy reference.( At the end of my discussion )

In vs 1-6 Paul states that the Hebrews are the chosen race the, human ancestry of our Lord, the receivers of the law etc. so in Vs 7 did God's word fail. No. No. God said in vs. 7 that it would be through Issac that your offspring shall be reckoned and in vs. 10 that the children of Rebecca having the same father one was chosen and the other was not.

In fact God said he hated Esau since he was in his mothers womb. Jacob he said he loved. vs 15 To Moses He said He would have mercy on whom He wanted to or compassion on whom He wanted. vs. 17 God said He hardened pharaoh's heart and raised him up for that very purpose. So what are we to make of all this. In fact Paul starts the argument Why Try. Are we even still responsible ?Why does God still blame us if He is so powerful.

The answer in vs 22-25 Does God set people up for destruction and wrath ? or God Forbid. Does God let us see how He destroys the people of the earth so that we would appreciate our calling ? No NO.

vs 25 Hosea says I will call them my people who are not my people vs 26 God says You are not my people but will be called son's of God. and about God's chosen people Isiah then said --unless the Lord had still honored our natural heritage we would have ended up like Sodom.

So what is the conclusion ?

In the end verses Paul talks about the stumbling block--works.

My conclusion is this. Righteousness if pursued by faith shall succeed by the law or not by the law. Righteousness if pursued by works shall fail by the law or not by the law. Remenber all the discussion about the contradiction of adherence to the law versis freedom from the law.

God is showing us in the old testament over and over how He chooses whom He will. God was preparing us for the day when He says I am the Lord God, I now choose all peoples of every race, every color, every country, every persuasion. I am God. I have shown you now my strategy and my purpose in hardening pharaoh's heart and picking Jacob from the womb.

For all these people that have not grown up under the law. For these people that have not understood the law from a child's age or from youth, then adherance to the law I cannot possibly use to give them my righteousness. To them , faith shall give them righteousness. It takes a lifetime of study to understand, It takes study from youth to know what is in my law. On how hard they study my law God says , that shall not count , although much study shall be required, but by faith shall I impute my righteousness to them.......In Christ.gregor

"""I speak the truth in Christ--I am not lying, my conscience confirms it in the Holy Spirit--
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I have great sorrow and unceasing anguish in my heart.
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For I could wish that I myself were cursed and cut off from Christ for the sake of my brothers, those of my own race,
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the people of Israel. Theirs is the adoption as sons; theirs the divine glory, the covenants, the receiving of the law, the temple worship and the promises.
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Theirs are the patriarchs, and from them is traced the human ancestry of Christ, who is God over all, forever praised! [1] Amen.
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It is not as though God's word had failed. For not all who are descended from Israel are Israel.
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Nor because they are his descendants are they all Abraham's children. On the contrary, "It is through Isaac that your offspring will be reckoned." [2]
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In other words, it is not the natural children who are God's children, but it is the children of the promise who are regarded as Abraham's offspring.
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For this was how the promise was stated: "At the appointed time I will return, and Sarah will have a son." [3]
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Not only that, but Rebekah's children had one and the same father, our father Isaac.
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Yet, before the twins were born or had done anything good or bad--in order that God's purpose in election might stand:
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not by works but by him who calls--she was told, "The older will serve the younger." [4]
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Just as it is written: "Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated." [5]
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What then shall we say? Is God unjust? Not at all!
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For he says to Moses, "I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion." [6]
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It does not, therefore, depend on man's desire or effort, but on God's mercy.
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For the Scripture says to Pharaoh: "I raised you up for this very purpose, that I might display my power in you and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth." [7]
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Therefore God has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy, and he hardens whom he wants to harden.
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One of you will say to me: "Then why does God still blame us? For who resists his will?"
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But who are you, O man, to talk back to God? "Shall what is formed say to him who formed it, 'Why did you make me like this?'" [8]
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Does not the potter have the right to make out of the same lump of clay some pottery for noble purposes and some for common use?
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What if God, choosing to show his wrath and make his power known, bore with great patience the objects of his wrath--prepared for destruction?
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What if he did this to make the riches of his glory known to the objects of his mercy, whom he prepared in advance for glory--
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even us, whom he also called, not only from the Jews but also from the Gentiles?
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As he says in Hosea: "I will call them 'my people' who are not my people; and I will call her 'my loved one' who is not my loved one," [9]
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and, "It will happen that in the very place where it was said to them, 'You are not my people,' they will be called 'sons of the living God.'" [10]
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Isaiah cries out concerning Israel: "Though the number of the Israelites be like the sand by the sea, only the remnant will be saved.
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For the Lord will carry out his sentence on earth with speed and finality." [11]
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It is just as Isaiah said previously: "Unless the Lord Almighty had left us descendants, we would have become like Sodom, we would have been like Gomorrah." [12]
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What then shall we say? That the Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have obtained it, a righteousness that is by faith;
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but Israel, who pursued a law of righteousness, has not attained it.
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Why not? Because they pursued it not by faith but as if it were by works. They stumbled over the "stumbling stone."
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As it is written: "See, I lay in Zion a stone that causes men to stumble and a rock that makes them fall, and the one who trusts in him will never be put to shame." [13]""