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Pastimes : Jesus -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Berry Picker who wrote (2091)	11/19/1999 7:04:00 PM
From: alan w	Respond to of 4775

God is not guilty...we are. You cannot understand how God can plan it without being guilty....I don't think any human mind can really figure that one...but that is what the Bible teaches and we are not called to question the revealed truth and Wisdom of God. Thanks Brian. For a while there, I thought you understood something I have been trying for years to figure out. alan w

To: Berry Picker who wrote (2091)	11/19/1999 11:27:00 PM
From: monu	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 4775

Brian, I think you would be very happy to know that I agree with much of what you said. Still there are a couple of things that I'm convinced you're mixed up on. This has nothing to do with whether or not you or me are saved. If you have given your heart to the Lord (regardless of the interpretation on how it occurred) then you are His. "Either way God created the world KNOWING that He would not even offer salvation to MANY for centuries and KNOWING they would go to hell !!" I don't know how you can say this. I don't know all the specifics nor do I have all understanding, but your view that God didn't give a flip for who knows how many years, is in my humble opinion, quite ridiculous, knowing the very nature of God. How do I know His ways the way I do? I have the mind of Christ. Okay, what exactly is free will? There have been many views on this over the years. Let's see what we do know. We know that mankind since the "fall" has been hopelessly enslaved to his sinful passions and does the bidding of Satan at his will. Man does have the ability however to "want" to do right. When he reaches the point that he recognizes he is helpless in actually doing what is Godly, he cries out for mercy. God hears. Not every man does this. Many are very satisfied living in sin. We know that it is God in the first place that draws man to this conclusion. After all, He is the author and finisher. Still man is able to "choose" God (for lack of a better word) when confronted with the reality that he is at odds with Him. I don't know where you get this "God is out of control" from my postings. I am saying that although God is sovreign, there is an element of "free will" working in mankind which is under His domain. I don't know how else to put it, otherwise as I said, God would have manufactured robots. "The 400 years of slavery of the Jews in Egypt was planned so that the Egyptians could STORE UP WRATH so that God could Justly Destroy them when He brought out Israel by a powerful hand !" Again, where do you get that from? The wages of sin is death. God didn't need to go through all that to "Justly Destroy" anybody! The bible mentions "love that surpasses knowledge". You and I don't have all the answers. I think we will all be surprised in that day how little we really did know. God had compassion on us. We will be forever grateful. He chooses at times not to reveal himself to some. They will indeed go to hell. He does look throughout the earth for those who in their ignorance (like Paul) are trying, really trying. He will not say "no" to a humble heart. Remember when Jesus said, "Jerusalem, Jerusalem, how often would I...but you would not." There is an element of free will. I COULD backslide...I COULD commit adultery...