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Politics : Formerly About Advanced Micro Devices -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Tenchusatsu who wrote (80909)	11/23/1999 11:50:00 PM
From: kash johal	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 1574005

Tench, Re:"Had I not known that was you, I could have sworn I was reading yet another anti-Intel rant from Thomas Pabst of Tom's Hardware Guide. Come on, Kash, I can understand why you're not too happy about the current Xeon not being much different than the Pentium IIIE. But I don't think that warrants this sort of outburst. How does this Xeon signify Intel's failure to listen to customers? If the customers don't want it, fine. Intel isn't going to hold a virtual gun to their heads and tell them that they're going to buy this Xeon "or else." That's a job for the mavericks in Redmond. By the way, Cascades, the "super XEONS with the HUGE on chip cache," is due around Q2 2000, or so the press says. (I'm not sure of the exact date myself.) That would mean it will be here before any of Athlon's derivatives shows up in the marketplace. Only AMD's upcoming Mustang core can hope to compete, but that won't come until sometime in 2H 2000." Well first I am sorry it came as a rant. As you know I think Intel is a very fine company. However they have stumbled recently. As you technical problems happen all the time and products get delayed all the time in the high tech biz. Howvever their attempt to foist RDRAM on the market is a clear mistake. It simply came from arrogance. And I put the latest Xeon fiasco in same light. Losing the server chipset buz to reliance is another case in point - Intel simply couldn't be bothered to develop a DDR server chipset - and that has been adopted even by DELL. Apparently Xeon volumes are LOW. Apparently PIII yields splits are excellent - double digit for the 733's. Apparently the PIII Xeon and PIII regular are same die. Perhaps they should have offered a 750Mhz or even an 800 Xeon slot II. But cynically taking the same chip and offering it at a higher price was pretty dumb IMHO. As far as Cascades I understood they were originally due in Q4 99 so maybe Q2 2000 is realistic. A 2 quarter slips seems about right for Intel. I guess Intel was due to ship those mobile 600Mhz geysers in Q4 99 as well so perhaps Q2 2000 we might see them as well. I hope Barret has lit a fire under some of the Intel VPs and they really are gonna show up with a real PC133 chipset with AGP4x and external Graphics etc by early Q1 or else they will be in a world of hurt again. I see Intel fumbling and bumling and most of it seems to have started after Grove handed day to day reigns at Intel to Barrett. I suspect this is more than just a coincidence. regards, Kash

To: Tenchusatsu who wrote (80909)	11/24/1999 1:01:00 AM
From: Cirruslvr	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 1574005

Tench - RE: "By the way, Cascades, the "super XEONS with the HUGE on chip cache," is due around Q2 2000, or so the press says. (I'm not sure of the exact date myself.) That would mean it will be here before any of Athlon's derivatives shows up in the marketplace. Only AMD's upcoming Mustang core can hope to compete, but that won't come until sometime in 2H 2000." Quite confident about Cascades vs. future Athlon derivatives are we? Check this out - anandtech.com and you see that Thunderbird will probably come out around the mid point of '00. Thunderbird would be the current Athlon with on-chip cache added on. And I wouldn't expect this cache to be of simple stuff. According to the Power Point presentation at amd.com these future Athlons will also have 1 and 2MB cache, and from the analyst meeting we know this will be on the chip, like Cascades. Oh yeah, the slide also says this L2 cache will be 16 way associative. So this doesn't look to be simple cache like the K6-III's. Also, look at how much of performance jump Katmai got with the L2 cache going on to the processor. Although this does have something to do with it being really good L2 cache, I would still expect the Athlon to get a similar boost when the L2 goes on board. The Athlon is ALREADY faster than the Cumine at the same clock speed (Check Tom's and Anand's reviews) so that means that when the cache goes on the processor at full speed, the Athlon will clearly be faster than Cumine. I wouldn't expect Cascades to be faster than this Thunderbird either because, again, it's L2 cache will be full speed on the chip and pretty good (16 way assoc.) and also because these Athlons will be run on a 266MHz bus AND they will be able to use faster RAM than right now. And as far as Mustang, you and I have no idea what the core enhancements will be so I don't see how you can say "Only AMD's upcoming Mustang core can hope to compete". AMD is probably adding these enhancements because Willamette is coming out around the same time so I wouldn't expect these enhancements to be simple stuff like enhanced 3DNow!... The Athlon is only going to get faster and FASTER. You guys better get used to it.