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Pastimes : Let's Talk About Our Feelings!!! -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Neocon who wrote (66454)	12/13/1999 12:24:00 PM
From: Daniel Schuh	Respond to of 108807

Funny, Neocon, neither of your articles seem to have anything to say in favor of spanking, or corporal punishment, or whatever. Just that "the research is flawed". Most research is flawed in some way or other, real researchers carry forward and fix the flaws, instead of just whining about what they disagree with. As I said at the end of Message 12269779, it's not a sufficient condition for kids to turn out bad, but it does seem to be a necessary one.

To: Neocon who wrote (66454)	12/13/1999 12:28:00 PM
From: Ilaine	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 108807

Larzelere's own research suggests that corporal punishment has negative effects: Psychol Rep 1989 Jun;64(3 Pt 2):1140-2 Relations of spanking and other parenting characteristics to self-esteem and perceived fairness of parental discipline. Larzelere RE, Klein M, Schumm WR, Alibrando SA Jr Punishment has long been a controversial topic in psychology, perhaps partly because its effects are different under different circumstances. This study used retrospective reports from college students to examine the effects of spanking, a common aversive punishment, on self-esteem and perceived fairness of parental discipline, while taking the effects of other parental characteristics into account. No parental characteristic interacted with the slightly negative effect of spanking on self-esteem and fairness. However, controlling for positive communication or for a parent-oriented motivation for spanking eliminated the negative effects of spanking, suggesting that the negative effects reflected use of spanking as a replacement for positive communication with the child. PMID: 2762458, UI: 89345906

To: Neocon who wrote (66454)	12/13/1999 7:08:00 PM
From: Edwarda	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 108807

Thank you, Neocon, for the article, which supports my lonely contention that there are no hard and fast rules for any human interaction. We are human and must try to balance all of what we know and are each time we interact.

To: Neocon who wrote (66454)	12/16/1999 11:06:00 PM
From: Grainne	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 108807

Neocon, the article you copied from US News and World Report is an old one, published prior to the results of the Canadian study. While it is true that it is possible to claim that all research is flawed in some way, your article also points out quite a few negatives to spanking, gives examples of non-spanking ways of disciplining children that are ridiculous and suggest the bias of the authors, set limits on spanking that is less likely to be harmful that are certainly not followed by most parents who do spank, and also points out that parents who spank are more likely to be poor, uneducated minorities. While it is quite egalitarian of you to be damm proud to be in such a downscale group, as a rather intellectual person I don't understand how you can cite such an article seriously. The bias of the authors is particularly obvious when they report that reported child abuse actually went up in Sweden after the no spanking law was passed. Gee, do you think that could possibly be because it had suddenly become ILLEGAL, and the crimes were REPORTED? Certainly, the reduction of child mortality in Sweden due to child abuse from 18% to 0% since the law was enacted would tend to suggest that child abuse has dropped, not increased, would it not?