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Pastimes : New Feelies, Sort of, For Anyone who Feels Like a Feelie -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Edwarda who wrote (356)	1/11/2000 4:59:00 PM
From: Neocon	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 485

And thus, the fun and games end, not with a bang, but......

To: Edwarda who wrote (356)	1/11/2000 5:01:00 PM
From: George S. Montgomery	Respond to of 485

Please do not take EdA's word for my attitude! I will express my attitude myself - without needing a spokesperson. Geo. PS: I agree with, endorse, and applaud everything Edwarda just said. G.

To: Edwarda who wrote (356)	1/11/2000 6:19:00 PM
From: The Philosopher	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 485

Got this in a PM: "________ asked me to pass on a special request from SI Bob that we stop riling up the natives on the new thread, since our continuation could be construed as harassment... " IMO it would be pretty hard to claim that the posts on Feelies2 violated the Terms of Use. The Terms of Use are a legal contract, so the term harassment needs to be given its legal meaning. The Washington definition of harassment is pretty generic. It defines harassment as: "Unlawful harassment" means a knowing and willful course of conduct directed at a specific person which seriously alarms, annoys, harasses, or is detrimental to such person, and which serves no legitimate or lawful purpose. The course of conduct shall be such as would cause a reasonable person to suffer substantial emotional distress, and shall actually cause substantial emotional distress to the petitioner. Has anybody on the thread reasonably suffered actual emotional distress? I doubt it. Were the posts "Using the service for illegal purposes or for the transmission of material that is unlawful, harassing, libelous, invasive of another's privacy, abusive, threatening, harmful, vulgar, obscene, tortious or otherwise objectionable."? (Quote from Terms of Use.) Otherwise objectionable is, of course, a very loose term, but given the ability to Ignore posters, I doubt they would get very far claiming the material in the posts was objectionable? The FACT of posting on that thread may have annoyed X and others, but the Terms of Use don't cover that, only the material posted. Much as I have appreciated SI Bob in the past, with the GNET takeover things seem to be much more hostile and corporate here, not changes for the better. Heck, a coffee shop is for relaxation and fun. People who start threads take what they get. I've started threads which deteriorated in ways I wished they hadn't, but that's the price of a free society. Bob did call a halt through a direct post to the thread, not by the back door private requests to a few people, to some really ugly stuff on Feelies a while back, and that was appropriate. The posts and personal attacks were getting more than nasty. But here, all it was was a few people enjoying posting to each other on a thread that had been started by people who gloried in their ability to censor those who they didn't like. It was an attempt, successful obviously, to poke fun at those who like to Ignore anybody they don't like, and draw attention to the censors by running the thread up the hot list. That seems to me a very appropriate form of social commentary. I suggest that X, CB, and SI Bob all need to lighten up and accept the benefits AND COSTS of living in a free society. On another topic, I hear a rumor that nihil has been permanently banned -- do you know about this, and if it's true why? I know he has the ability to be nasty, but heck, we're all adults here. If the Syrians and Isralis can sit down at the same table together, surely we can share the same chat room as adults.

To: Edwarda who wrote (356)	1/12/2000 3:16:00 PM
From: E	Read Replies (5) \| Respond to of 485

<<<We meant in a light and fun way to make a commentary on the negative use of Ignore, not to wound or to open wounds.>>> I just read this thread from the beginning to the end. I myself don't use Ignore. Something about it bothers me. I'm a First Amendment fan, and I get my categories confused, I think. It's a visceral thing. But I want to say, nonetheless, that Ignore is a feature members certainly have a right to use if they are here for fun and are finding themselves prevented from having it by posts repellent to them. I wish no mention had been made of the whole ignore business. It was provocative. I acknowledge that. But Edwarda, your iterating and reiterating that the invasion you invited of this thread by those whom it was founded to escape (because they precipitated the destruction of feelies, however often you and they claim they didn't-- we have disagreed about this before) was a "prank" and in the spirit of friendly "fun", however exculpating a mantra, doesn't change the fact that it had the only result it could have been expected to have. It was hostile and confrontational and it aggressively deprived others of the distance they were seeking. It predictably opened wounds. So this is just to say that I accept that it is provocative to talk about whom you're ignoring. But it didn't imo call for the invasion, especially that sort of invasion. Why can't your friends ignore instead of pursuing? Just my opinion. You have a right to engage in battle as much as anyone else does, Edwarda. But I urge you to admit a spade is a spade. That was battle. New, but not entirely, subject: Is it true, do you know, that nihil is banned permanently? I know he's not your favorite SI poster, but I feel him to be a real loss to the community here, and feel bad about it. Others do, too. He is outrageous, but he... has wit, and texture, and an esthetic, and originality. There is no other like nihil here, and no other outrageousness quite like his, either. Do you know what he did that was worse than what so many others have done? Is this something you might consider using your considerable influence in these parts to try to undo? I'm going to PM SI Bob, and I'm wondering how you would feel about doing the same.... I've hardly been on SI lately, it was certainly startling to return and find these developments. I haven't yet read the next feelies.