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Politics : Ask Michael Burke -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: Don Lloyd who wrote (76426)2/23/2000 10:27:00 AM
From: Skeeter Bug  Respond to of 132070
 
don, the shares are an obligation. they are "owed" to employees. in this sense they are debt.



To: Don Lloyd who wrote (76426)2/23/2000 12:07:00 PM
From: Michael Bakunin  Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 132070
 
I can't speak to Parish's application of the SAS (cf aicpa.org, but for all my dislike of their products, I see MSFT's financial reporting as aggressive, not fraudulent. Their behavior appears legal, and merely (ahem) takes advantage of current tax law to maximize cash flow. That they further leave their options grants unhedged (and do, de facto if not de GAAP incur a contingent liability) is a separate issue. Now that FASB requires a fair level of detail on ESOPs (like derivatives, which options after all are) in the footnotes, I see this issue confined to the analysts' purview. As an analyst I'd be nervous about the sources of Microsoft's cash flow and compensation savings; I'd adjust their EPS down from reported levels to reflect options expense hidden under APB 25; I'd perform a sensitivity analysis to estimate the effect on their valuation of changes in legal or market environment -- but I would not ship them off to jail. Rather, given my druthers I'd require SFAS 123 for headline EPS and discontinue favorable tax treatment, both of which I see as distortions. Recall that I see options as having intrinsic value, which needs to be charged against earnings if written, whether to employees or to third parties. I see unhedged ESOPs as a sort of tax-leveraged liability; as the stock goes up, so does the liability -- but with the promise of saving a third of the gains above the strike on taxes. If the stock goes down, the options expire, and the company keeps 100% of the implicit premium, just like an options writer in the market. It is this tax-induced asymmetry that makes nonqualified ESOPs so very attractive and underlies my opinion on distortion. -mb



To: Don Lloyd who wrote (76426)2/23/2000 5:18:00 PM
From: Freedom Fighter  Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 132070
 
Don,

Parrish's mistake is his assumption that MSFT must buy back the shares as they are exercised. MSFT need only issue more shares and dilute the company. Obviously whether they go through tons of cash repurchasing the options or issue 800 million new shares over time it is a net negative for the current common shareholders, but the options are not a debt equivalent in my book.

Almost the entire technology sector is running a taxpayer subsidized pyramid scheme right now.

They issue options as compensation that don't get expensed.

They then use the extra cash to make investments in other technology companies issuing options and making investments.

When the options get exercised they get a tax benefit on the difference between the exercise price and the stock price. This is known as "full cost accounting" and gives them the maximum possible tax break on something they never expensed.

The tax break gives them extra cash to invest.

They then sell investments in companies using the similar model in order to make their earnings numbers.

None of the stock prices are based on the true operating performances of the underlying companies.

There's a lot of great technology companies out there, but they are simultaneously getting away with running a huge scam on investors and taxpayers because the economic reality is not being captured and in some cased purposely ignored (Wall St.) It truly is a wealth transfer mechanism.

If everything was marked to operating reality the Nasdaq would fall 75%.

Wayne



To: Don Lloyd who wrote (76426)2/24/2000 5:34:00 PM
From: Earlie  Respond to of 132070
 
Don:

Bill does take his arguments to extension, but there is no doubt in my mind that his basic point, that MSFT is pulling off a massive scam through the employee option tax situation, is right on the money.

Of course, so long as the stock price stays in space, few give a darn.

One point that Bill makes which some do not agree with, but that makes perfect sense to me, is that a bunch of pension funds are at massive risk as a result of this scam.
Best, Earlie