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Strategies & Market Trends : DAYTRADING Fundamentals -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Dan Clark who wrote (9000)	6/17/2000 1:54:00 PM
From: LPS5	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 18137

Further, they seemed to occur most often when the stock was at some S/R point. If this was just MM's marking orders up and down, why the regularity? Why would this occur at S/R points? For the very reason you imply: the points you mention, whether real or perceived support or resistance points, are where activity - therefore volume - is concentrated as traders of all varieties and odors attempt to catch a bounce or turn. Lots of things happen at these points which could, and in fact should, lead to some outlying executions due to the technological and/or brokerage issues and practices previous discussed. LPS5

To: Dan Clark who wrote (9000)	6/17/2000 1:55:00 PM
From: Robert Graham	Respond to of 18137

I do think your reference to the spikes occurring at S or R may be significant. At least with futures, this is where the floor can play their games. This is particularly the case at key reference points like at a intraday H/L or an "obvious" trend line. There are many trend line drawers out there that the floor has a picnic with. But in the case of an MM driven electronic market like the NASDAQ, IMO one MM can provide this form of "entertainment" to the trader. I am making just a comment here. I am not saying what you are seeing is a form of "head fake" or "painting the tape". I would have to see it for myself to make this observation. And I actually see "painting the tape" to be an affair that goes over a period of time and range of prices that is instigated by a group of participants. Bob Graham PS: I just read the reply from LPS5 on this subject which makes sense to me. Perceived S&R is where volume is more likely to be found. But they are also where "manipulation" possibilities can be found too. Furthermore, there is no reason why the MM is not be aware of S&R points in the management of a large order. I would if I were in their shoes. PPS: I see all of this being discussed as what needs to be expected by the trader trading in these markets. It is a fact of life to be aware of how price can respond in situations. Artificial or "genuine" price movement is to a large extent irrelevant to the trader, for both have to be dealt with, and can be dealt with without understanding specifically what is causing it. Just stick to liquid markets and liquid periods in those markets.

To: Dan Clark who wrote (9000)	6/17/2000 1:57:00 PM
From: OZ	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 18137

Given that and that you were "shocked", this implies that these rules are not well known or publicized. Thanks for the kind words Dan. But just remember that time spent learning ALL the the ins and outs of rules is usually better spent focusing on your trading. I myself have been forced to learn this since I am trading OPM. But i agree that there are some essentials that should be known if you are going to do this for a living. Here is the homepage with the link NASD MANUAL on it. nasdr.com Here is the direct link to where you want to go secure.nasdr.com If this was just MM's marking orders up and down, why the regularity? Why would this occur at S/R points? I am surprised you did not get that one yourself. Support and resistance points ARE EXACTLY where all the STOP orders are located. People want in or out NOW when those get hit. Remember that STOP orders turn to market orders when hit. Also remember that these are either mental stops, software stops or broker managed stops since the NASDAQ does not have an order book with stops on them. You probably get allot of "spike" at whole numbers too. OZ