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Pastimes : Let's Talk About Our Feelings!!! -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Daniel Schuh who wrote (83044)	6/28/2000 1:35:00 PM
From: Ilaine	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 108807

Shame, you're being lazy. I doubt very much that "most countries we might compare ourselves to" have national health care coverage. Source, please?

To: Daniel Schuh who wrote (83044)	6/28/2000 1:38:00 PM
From: Ilaine	Respond to of 108807

Here is a statistic for you - 74 million Americans receive government provided health care coverage - that's roughly one third of the population. hcfa.gov

To: Daniel Schuh who wrote (83044)	6/28/2000 1:46:00 PM
From: Ilaine	Respond to of 108807

Here is another statistic for you - it's somewhat out of date, I'll have to see if I can find a more recent one - Uninsured Population An estimated 35-37 million Americans. 56% are workers. 28% are children. 16.5% are nonworking adults. 83% of workers have private insurance. (AMA, 1993) So that's maybe 15% of Americans that don't have coverage. Of those, how many are self-employed? How many are young people who don't think they need coverage? I will keep looking. Another good question - are we sure that the 35 million doesn't include people who are married to someone with coverage? And has the statistic changed since COBRA was enacted? Hunting . . . . Edit: Dick Armey claimed 15% in 1999, and if anyone would mis-state the figure higher than it really is, I think he would. So let's assume 15%. Of those, I argue that the majority of adults are what we call "working poor." Can they afford health care coverage? Who knows? Can they afford cigarettes and beer?

To: Daniel Schuh who wrote (83044)	6/28/2000 1:58:00 PM
From: Ilaine	Respond to of 108807

Isn't what's really going on the following: 1. Skyrocketing costs due to the assumption that everyone is entitled to the type of care that once was unimaginable? Organ transplants, and so forth? 2. Skyrocketing costs for AIDS victims, who have a very good lobby? 3. Skyrocketing costs for retirees, who want to live forever, and also have a very good lobby? Recently someone suggested, I am not sure on which thread, that the vast majority of medical expense occurs during the last few days of life, when the health care provider goes to extraordinary measures to prolong a life that is not salvageable. We aren't really fighting about well-baby care, you know. The real agenda lies elsewhere.

To: Daniel Schuh who wrote (83044)	6/28/2000 2:18:00 PM
From: Zoltan!	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 108807

>>Most countries we might care to compare ourselves to have better aggregate health statistics, lower health care costs, and a national health care system of some kind. Wrong. National health care = higher costs.

To: Daniel Schuh who wrote (83044)	6/28/2000 2:25:00 PM
From: Ilaine	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 108807

OK, here's the scoop, directly from the Census Bureau. The most recent data are from 1998. In 1998, out of a population of 271 million, 44 million had no health care coverage. Out of that population, the income breakdown is as follows: Less than $25K annual income, 17.2 million Between $25K and $49.9K, 14.8 million(!) Between $50K and $74.K, 6.7 million(!!) More than $75K income, 5.5 million(!!!) I would argue that more than half of uninsured people can actually afford to pay for health insurance, but choose not to. Get this - 30% of uninsured are between the age of 18 and 24! Only 1.1% are age 65 or over. Health care crisis? Or a rational decision by healthy people not to pay for health care coverage? For the vast majority of the uninsured, I would argue a rational decision. census.gov