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Pastimes : Let's Talk About Our Feelings!!! -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Frederick Smart who wrote (86241)	8/23/2000 8:23:33 PM
From: epicure	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 108807

I really don't care whether I get toasted by anyone else or not. I've never cared much what other people think- perhaps you are like that too, I really can't tell. And I mean that most sincerely. I really can't. Although it annoys me when people misunderstand me- it annoys me as much when people like me for spurious reasons as when they hate me for spurious reasons. That's just a personal idiosyncrasy. I tend to correct people who say false things about me whether they are good or bad false things. I am glad you don't put me in the enemy box. Because I'm not. NOW- who is this "we": "We are really angry at ourselves for NOT embracing our own energy in the present moment. And since we don't want to accept the fact that we're responsible for our own feelings we knee-jerk ourselves into a familiar pattern of assigning blame to others outside of ourselves. " Speaking for ME- I'm not angry at anyone. Annoyed by the posts of some people, yes, angry, no. I embrace my own energy all the time. I don't think YOU have the power or energy (if you like) to see me embracing my own energy- IF you are including ME in your WE (again, I've no way of knowing what you mean). But I can guarantee you I am embracing a rip roaring fountain of female X energy all day. Also, I do NOT "not want to accept the fact that I am responsible for my own feelings". I do accept the fact that I am responsible for my own feelings and in fact I am on a thread called "Let's talk about our Feelings"- it is not called "Let's talk About why we're Not Responsible for our Feelings". Again, who knows if you meant ME with the WE- but you posted it to ME and when you do that certain assumptions will be made by the reader- for example that you are talking to them, and that we includes you and the reader, at the very least. Now- the knee jerk pattern of blaming others- what is this pattern, who is doing it, and who is being blamed for what? You STILL haven't answered my point about the vaccinations. I'd really like an answer to that.

To: Frederick Smart who wrote (86241)	8/23/2000 9:07:06 PM
From: jbe	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 108807

If you so much as waver in my direction you will be toasted by the clique on this board. That sounds really paranoid, Fred. Certainly it lacks "positive energy," however you try to soften it by saying you are determined to "love your enemies." The fact is that you have decided we (the "clique") are all your enemies. Frankly, I'm disappointed. I rather liked your last post to me. I thought that perhaps something was getting through to you. For one thing, you agreed with my comment that "perhaps you should stop talking so much about your own experiences and start displaying an interest in the experiences of others." You went on to explain whyyou talk about yourself: it is, you said, because you "believe in taking risks to expose oneself first." I dare say that is what you believe. But the problem is that it comes across as boasting. Your idea of "service" is very like what Judaism/Christianity/Islam all call "charity" (which goes beyond alms-giving). Charity (zakat) is one of the five pillars of Islam, for example. Every believer is expected to give 2.5% of his income to charity. What he gives beyond that is "sadaqa" -- sometimes translated as "voluntary charity" -- which should, insofar as possible, be given anonymously, and in secret. We are not necessarily talking money here. As the Prophet said: "Even meeting your brother with a cheerful face is charity." The point is that all forms of zakat are viewed as service, service that should be rendered without any thought of recognition. So by focussing on your own experiences, you may be preventing your message from getting across. Back to your post. After proclaiming your own willingness to risk self-exposure, you went on: Most people like to sit on the sidelines and point fingers. I'm not saying they are bad or good. It's just an overriding nature for most people. They get into comfort zones and end up back scratching/feeding off others. Then for alot of groups, there's this mutual agenda of blaming, pointing and judging others which feeds more energy into the clique, supporting the negative paradigm. I think I see the problem here. Actually, there seem to be two problems: 1) You have a very negative view of "most people," and you are quick to "blame" them and "point fingers" at them, and assume they are in need of your "uplifting." 2) You seem to regard any attempt to criticize/analyze your ideas, as you express them, as a manifestation of "negativity" and "finger-pointing." Seems to me you are just uncomfortable with debate. Most people on this thread thrive on debate. Frankly, it's fun (at least, when it's civil). There does not have to be anything "negative" about it. On the contrary, after a good debate/discussion, the participants may find that they have changed their views, at least a little, based on what they have heard. If you think about it a little, I think you will find that many people have objected not so much to your message per se, as to your style of expressing it. As my mother used to say to me, with a sigh: "It isn't what you say, dear. It's how you say it." :-)