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Politics : Piffer Thread on Political Rantings and Ravings -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Original Mad Dog who wrote (470)	11/27/2000 10:36:29 PM
From: mph	Respond to of 14610

Both Gore and Bush have suffered from parody. Gore is stiff. Bush is dumb. Who decides these things anyway? As for the speech, here are some general observations. 1. If Gore had sought a statewide recount, not just in selected Democratic counties, and had his party not fought so hard to get military ballots thrown out, then his statement that: That is all we have asked since Election Day: a complete count of all the votes cast in Florida. Not recount after recount as some have charged, but a single, full and accurate count might have a ring of truth. The military ballot fiasco undercuts these statements, IMO. 2. These statements are also a problem: We haven't had that yet. Great efforts have been made to prevent the counting of these votes. Lawsuit after lawsuit has been filed to delay the count and to stop the counting for many precious days between Election Day and the deadline for having the count finished. He also suggests that tactics delayed the counts. However, the counts continued after deadlines and there was never an injunction prohibiting the counts from continuing. You already have my views on the Fla. Supreme Court deadline. 3.In one county, election officials brought the count to a premature end in the face of organized intimidation. He better have hard proof that it was organized by the Republican party. That's all I can say. If he doesn't, this is an irresponsible statement. Since no evidence has been cited to prove this, well...... JMO

To: Original Mad Dog who wrote (470)	11/28/2000 12:09:53 AM
From: Jorj X Mckie	Respond to of 14610

It all seems entirely reasonable when printed out like that....except that it takes it out of context. Gore only wants those votes counted that he feels will help him. Just as Bush only wants the votes counted that he feels will help him. If there is going to be a re-count, it should include the thrown out military votes and if there isn't then all of the questionable ballots, including the questionable military ballots should be excluded. The idea of a dimpled ballot be considered a valid vote does bother me no matter what. I have put the little push pin thingie in the wrong hole and stopped before puncturing the card before. I assume that that created a dimpled chad. It is entirely reasonable to assume that the dimpled chads were caused by someone changing their mind rather than someone intending to cast a vote. So, in the context of what Gore has said in the past, the text of the speech is equally bothersome. At this point though, hearing either bush or gore speak causes my hackles to rise.

To: Original Mad Dog who wrote (470)	11/28/2000 7:19:21 AM
From: Oral Roberts	Respond to of 14610

I guess my first problem is that the votes that are not being counted are not legally cast votes for either man. They either have no one selected, or they have 2 people selected. They are not legally cast ballots. To selectively recount only areas that he feels will be beneficial to him is also not getting every vote to count, but just his, as an example look at the oversea's ballots. With that said I actually respect what he has done. He fought a great fight and has turned this to where people think that legally cast votes are not being counted because of the Republican's. He tried and could not get enough votes. I think the time has come now for him to stop fighting. The longer it goes on the more it looks like he will stop at nothing to become Pres. It's not a very Presidential sight IMHO. Jeff

To: Original Mad Dog who wrote (470)	11/28/2000 7:23:46 AM
From: Oral Roberts	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 14610

OMD, I also asked this on another thread but would appreciate your input if you have the time. It would seem to me that GW does not have a lot to gain by the hearing with the SC on Friday. He is certified in FL and the hand counting is over. I would think the Gore lawyers in FL are going to have a heck of a time turning this over down there. But what would happen if the US Supreme Court agreed with the FL SC? I think that might embolden a local judge to order more recounts. I mean the only thing GW can get out of this is to hear them say the FL SC erred, right? Jeff