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Politics : Why is Gore Trying to Steal the Presidency? -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Ellen who wrote (2660)	11/27/2000 11:13:29 PM
From: MasonS	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 3887

Ellen...we have all answered you at one time or another...we have backed up our opinions with numerous articles... What's the point of answering you...you are so biased in your opinion there is no discussion...only you repeating the same things over and over and over. Any intelligent person watching those handcounts knows that it is simply not fair...it is partisan and inconsistent...period. And we all know who started the lawsuits in Florida...not Bush...IT WAS GORE. Then he conveniently dropped them and moved on to what his real mission was...to mine votes...period. Bush is the "fully vote-verified winner" for the third no fourth time...period. All the votes have been counted...twice by machine...and once by manual recount. If the counties chose not to recount or couldn't get them in on time (because they wanted to enjoy their Thanksgiving dinner)...too bad for them...period. Bush did not box himself into any corner...he knew that a manual recount in Florida with NO STANDARDS would be inaccurate and partisan...period.

To: Ellen who wrote (2660)	11/27/2000 11:34:23 PM
From: The Philosopher	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 3887

This is a sincere and sincerely-curious question: Doesn't it bother anyone at all that Bush has tried to prevent (successfully to date) all votes from being counted in order to win? A bit. But first, all the votes were counted; some were just counted as not voted for either candidate. That happens in every election in virtually every precinct (maybe in Dix Notch or whatever it is in New Hampshire there are no spoiled or unreadable ballots, but elsewhere there are ALWAYS votes that are cast where the voter had something in his or her mind but didn't manage to make their intention clear under the rules of the voting process. Even if every ballot were to be inspected a dozen times, there would still be some votes not counted. In this case, I am more likely to trust machines which have no political affiliation to count ballots objectively than sometimes strident party members clearly trying to dig up votes to favor their party. So it doesn't bother me that much, since he is trying to keep political decision making out of the vote counting process. If there were a way to assure a truly fair and objective hand count, it would bother me more that Bush opposes it. But that's not the reality. This is a sincere and sincerely-curious question: Are Republicans truly pleased and satisfied that Bush is currently the certified winner rather than the fully vote-verified winner? Ah, but he IS the fully vote-verified winner. So that's a non question. As an American (not as a Republican or a Democrat), it scares the hell out of me that anyone can possibly 'win' an election by preventing votes from being counted. Well, it scares me far more that the political operatives of one party can, weeks after the election is over, still be manipulating ballots, finding more ballots, etc. I don't know whether you're old enough to remember the Democratic machine of Chicago in the 50s and 60s, but there wasn't a fair election in that city in many years. And now a sincere and sincerely-curious question back to you. Would you truly be as outraged if Gore were ahead by 500 votes and the election was certified in his favor but Jeb had his people in place in all the precincts ready to recount thousands of ballots and Bush was demanding that the courts let his brother's troops loose to work on the ballots and find him a few hundred more votes? And another sincere and sincerely-curious question back to you. Does it bother you that two members of the Florida Supreme Court were contributors to Gore's campaign but still decided to sit in judgment on his lawsuit rather than recusing themselves? Let's face it. This election is no longer about fairness, or voter intentions, or who gets to count what votes. It's about pure, unadulterated politics of the worst kind on both sides. Period.

To: Ellen who wrote (2660)	11/28/2000 2:09:54 AM
From: KLP	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 3887

Ellen, can only speak for myself, and short answer to your question is : Yes..Satisfied Bush is the certified winner. Reasoning: We Americans are a wonderfully fortunate group of people. We have nearly instant communications, and KNOW when we should vote. We know the hours of voting, the places, have (or should have) read the voter's pamphlets, understand (or certainly should have) BEFORE we go to do our duty: to VOTE. Most of us have trusted that our vote did and will count. The ONLY people in America that might have trouble voting on election day were the Military, working on our behalf all around the world. Don't forget, just before the election, the USS Cole had just suffered a huge loss..17 people died, many more injured, to say nothing of the damage to the ship itself. Our Forces were still on alert during this time... In my opinion, the Military are the ONLY ones who should be given ANY slack....(and I am hopeful that after the election, we will as citizens be able to understand just all the reasons some of them NEVER did get their requested ballots, the reasons they weren't sent on time, and the reasons they weren't delivered on time. In every election I've ever voted in (MANY, it seems) the onus was on "me" to do it right the first time. (QUAINT notion I know.....I AM RESPONSIBLE....) In these cases, the people had up to 3 times to get it right. The votes were then machine tallied. Because the vote was close, the votes were then re-tallied. That should be the end of the story. Period. But it hasn't been. If there was any further recounting to be done, IMO, it should have been the ENTIRE State. If ANY machines were faulty, the Election Board for the County in question should have some serious explaining to do!! It is their JOB to get it right!!! This is a sincere and sincerely-curious question: Are Republicans truly pleased and satisfied that Bush is currently the certified winner rather than the fully vote-verified winner