To: epicure who wrote (3742 ) 12/1/2000 7:48:56 PM From: Greg or e Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 28931 I could say that most of your posts are silly and ridiculous as well. If that's the level of debate you wish to enter into, then find someone else who is willing to engage in it with you because I am not interested in trading insults with you. On a more serious note, I don't think I need to prove to you that humans are inescapably moral, it is self evident. Even your response noted Now all societies have "morality"- which is simply to say that all societies have rules.... You make a distinction between rules and morality, but I simply see one as the outworking of the other. It is often said (erroneously) that "you can't legislate morality," but all legislation is a reflection of some moral principal or principals. The fact remains that wherever you go, you will find human beings making distinctions about what is right and what is wrong. Yes, there are societal differences, but the similarities are far more striking than the differences. C.S. Lewis points this out brilliantly in his classic book Mere Christianity, The fact that it is hard to come to any absolute agreement about what is right and wrong amongst us, I suspect, has more to do with the fact that we are all guilty of the very things we say are wrong for others. Ask a thief about stealing and he will probably say "at least I'm honest" ya, now that he's been caught. Ask a liar about truth and he will probably say "at least I'm not a thief" but he's probably lying about that to. There is honor amongst thieves and there are thieves amongst the honorable. We all have logs in our eyes when it comes to seeing our own sin but 20 20 when it's the other guy. The human capacity to rationalize our own guilt, while at the same time screaming for justice to be done in the case of others, demonstrates not only the fact (yes I said fact) that there are universal norms for right and wrong, but also that we fail to meet the very standards that we expect of everybody but ourselves. In other words we know what's right but we are unable to do it. This is the position that we find ourselves in and that is precisely why the claims of Christ are relevant to every person on the planet. It's not "silly" in the least. Have a good day, Greg