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To: patron_anejo_por_favor who wrote (84849)	1/20/2001 5:37:12 PM
From: Gottfried	Respond to of 95453

patron, >Seems the "voluntary" conservation measures have failed miserably< It's too early to say that. Significant voluntary conservation has only just started and has been credited with making a couple of threatened blackouts unnecessary. Conservation won't solve the whole problem, but will help. To say it's useless doesn't help. Gottfried

To: patron_anejo_por_favor who wrote (84849)	1/20/2001 6:58:35 PM
From: dfloydr	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 95453

Polls in California as recently as a day or two ago were finding that Californians do not yet believe the shortage is real. The predominant view still is that the greedy power companies are ripping them off and using blackouts as a way to bully everyone into allowing higher rates. With that being the attitude, conservation ain't going to happen. La La Land is waiting for Tinkerbell to sprinkle power dust all over California and Peter Pan to chase the evil power companies out of the state.

To: patron_anejo_por_favor who wrote (84849)	1/20/2001 11:30:53 PM
From: Zeuspaul	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 95453

Seems the "voluntary" conservation measures have failed miserably. Are not rolling blackouts a form of "mandatory" conservation? How else would you have it done? Conservation hasn't been tried yet. There are some signs of conservation now because people are starting to believe there is an energy crisis due to the black outs. No voluntary guidelines have been set forth..people have been led to believe that there is not a problem...at least not for the individual ie the Gore thing...I'll (Davis) fight those evil energy producers for you. How would I do it?? A concerted effort with an address to the state with specific and mandatory guidelines. People just have to be told to conserve and they will comply. Ie We got a problem..we can either pay triple the price or conserve..so conserve and here's how ya do it. Zeuspaul

To: patron_anejo_por_favor who wrote (84849)	1/20/2001 11:32:22 PM
From: energyplay	Respond to of 95453

Need to raise retail prices in CA I strongly agree with the Patron Anejo statement - Voluntary isn't working, and damages high value business, mandatory won't work (far too much civil disobedience / lack of awareness). I'm paying 8 cent a KWH in Silicon valley, where average personal income is > $ 60k, and household income is >80k. Rates could double, and 90% persent of high tech wouldn't blink. Even the semi makers have high gross margins and could easily eat the higher elctrical cost. Adverstising signs are still on, Christmas lights were on all December, and even Intel's buildings have flourescent lights on all the time (and since the only work 14 hour days, you know it's wasted the other 10 hours) A large increase, followed by a time of day and/or demand pricing model for large industrial and commercial users, would quickly cut demand, and cause and easing in wholesale pricing also. This would stop the utilities from going deeper in the hole. With a relaxation in clean air rules, we could make it through the summer, and with a few more plants online in fall, maybe make it to mid 2002, when many more plans will convert the electricity shortage to an NG shortage. ;-) If we get an additional pipeline built by 2004, we'll be okay... California needs reliable electricity. It doesn't need cheap electricity any more than it needs cheap land or cheap gasoline. My prediction : it will take about 7-10 days, but we will see closer to market pricing at least for industry and large commercial users, and maybe a 'token' hike for consumers. This would help, since Intel can out bid Kmart, and Kmart will turn out enough lights at peak times. In this sceanario, agriculture and low value industry gets shafted...but neither Diane Fienstein or Gray Davis take their calls anyway.