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Politics : Sharks in the Septic Tank -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Greg or e who wrote (13282)	5/8/2001 8:13:17 PM
From: Lane3	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 82486

The fact that all civilizations have a concept of a creator as well as moral notions, just proves my point. It sure doesn't look that way to me. First you say "Salvation is by the grace of God alone, through faith in Jesus Christ alone. This is what God has revealed to all people through His word, the Bible." Then you say that we all have a sense of a creator and morals like that's good enough. Which is it? I don't know where my moral compass came from, whether from some deity or not, but I sure know it's wrong to penalize those people to whom the Creator gave no opportunity to find Jesus. What poor excuse for a deity would do that? Conversely, if you don't penalize them, then Jesus can't be an essential part of the equation. You can't have it both ways. Either you have a Gospel that's unacceptably unfair or Jesus is not the requisite path to salvation. Karen

To: Greg or e who wrote (13282)	5/8/2001 10:26:07 PM
From: Solon	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 82486

The fact that all civilizations have a concept of a creator as well as moral notions, just proves my point Does it Greg? The fact that people have notions of what is and isn't in their best interest proves what point? The fact that people seek power, and the fact that thunder, ligthning, and rain were mysterious to the pre-scientific era proves what point? That the Hebrew imagination was superior to the Hindu, and the Muslim, and the Cherokee--just because you happen to be white? "Just because the ancients did not know about the Laws of physics, does not mean they were stupid." Then why pretend they were? Why pretend they worshipped false gods, idols, etc., and will thus be tortured forever in Hell??? Why pretend the BIG BANG is an adequate substitute for not having the latest translation of the Hebrew/Pauline bible which was chosen by the church fathers when it jumped into the air, while the scriptures they didn't like just sort of rolled to the floor, mostly to mysteriously disappear? Quite the contrary, they would look at someone who denied something so obvious as a moral creator as being something of a moron. No. If you told them that their God was false and yours was true, they would probably kill you. I cannot believe how primitive you think. I have handled you with kid gloves for months and months on the SGBR thread. I have only hoped to convince you that the beliefs of other people are not inferior to yours, and that their gods are not inferior to yours; and that you do not set the rules and moral standards for the rest of humankind. But you don't get it. YOU JUST DON"T GET IT. You have nothing but contempt for the beliefs of others--nothing but disdain. And everytime another group gets killed in the Middle East you pipe up with your gleeful foolishness about keeping our eyes on Jerusalem, the time is near. Christ, you make me tired. Reason apparently means nothing to you. You are simply the de facto arbiter of what is TRUE. Go stick your fingerprints on your pots. We have many pots from people who believed in GODS you have never even heard of--Gods who are at least respectable. What do you think, Greg? Is your GOD, who used to carry a sword alongside HIS PEOPLE, going to destroy ALLAH?? Or will your god do the compassionate thing and stop fooling all those millions of people? Your God is racist, Greg. UNfortunately for you, it is all in the scriptures! Even Jesus boasted about hiding the truth from the Gentiles so they would be unable to get to heaven. And what did Jesus know about Heaven? Nothing. What did he know about Hell? Only what the Persian tradition had taught the political hacks who out-maneuvered the Jews. Anyway, thank you so much for dismissing the heartfelt beliefs of all people ouitside of the Christian faith. Give yourself a powerful thrill for doing it...

To: Greg or e who wrote (13282)	5/8/2001 11:50:33 PM
From: The Philosopher	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 82486

"A little philosophy inclineth man's mind to atheism, but depth in philosophy bringeth men's minds about to religion." -Francis Bacon 1561-1626 So athiests are just those too shallow in their philsophy. Seems to fit certain posters here. And fits my life. I was an atheist for a while in my teens, but learned beyond it.

To: Greg or e who wrote (13282)	5/9/2001 12:44:18 AM
From: Solon	Respond to of 82486

"I have only hoped to convince you that the beliefs of other people are not inferior to yours, and that their gods are not inferior to yours; and that you do not set the rules and moral standards for the rest of humankind. But you don't get it. YOU JUST DON"T GET IT." Good night Greg. I'm going back to work. You get yourself some sleep. Good night, Greg. Praise Allah, praise Manitou--praise Shiva. May you have dreams of love and peace for your brothers and sisters--as they walk the earth in good faith and hope. You are all of these. Please do not hurt them--spit your frantic hysteria upon me instead. I am here to accept your hatred of those whom are not the CHOSEN. I shall be honored by your spittal. Thank you.