To: Robert Salasidis who wrote (135742 ) 5/21/2001 1:52:04 PM From: dougSF30 Respond to of 186894 Robert, Re: To add my .02 worth to the debate, anyone that could conceivably claim a crash is better than a throttle back, doesn't do any useful work on a computer. As someone who has done useful work on a computer, let me make a point or two in response: 1) Actually, there are often times when a fatal error is preferred to a 'subtle failure' (read: bug) that doesn't manifest until far downstream, making diagnosis and correction much more difficult. In this case, imagine you're running a busy server cluster for an ecommerce site (okay, pretend it was a year ago or so :) ). Would you rather discover hard failure during initial stress testing, or, on that day you finally get 5000 simultaneous visitors, have everything become slow as molasses for periods of time? One could argue that the initial stress testing might not trigger the crash, so this argument is so-so. 2) I think we're claiming we prefer a throttleless design accompanied by real thermal specs (e.g. the Athlon), which OEMs can design into systems that a) don't throttle back, and b) have no thermal-related crashes, as they have adequate thermal solutions. Intel is 1) making it difficult for OEMs to know what an adequate thermal solution is, since they publish 'real world' thermal specs, instead of 'real' thermal specs, and 2) actually *encouraging* them to get by with cheap thermal solutions, relying on the throttling in hot situations. 3) apparently unable to tell us that the throttle will not activate at times even *with* a great thermal solution, with some (granted not the best) evidence to the contrary floating around. Doug p.s. I agree that the duty-cycle register would be nice.