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Pastimes : G&K Investing for Curmudgeons -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: EnricoPalazzo who wrote (15123)	6/17/2001 1:19:16 AM
From: molemania	Respond to of 22706

man, what a great fact filled post! yea, kareem was unbelievably humble compared to these guys today. i just saw a bunch of slow motion footage of kobe on ESPN and that dude palms or carries the ball like no one i have ever seen. how can they let that guy get away with that??? it isn't even subtle. a guy like iverson might do it once in a while but at least he's moving fast and doesn't play with the ball deliberately like kobe. my dad used to scream about the big O carrying the ball but he'd roll over in his grave if he saw kobe.

To: EnricoPalazzo who wrote (15123)	6/17/2001 12:55:21 PM
From: Dr. Id	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 22706

Kareem's 30 point era (or should I say 25-30 point era) lasted about 15 of his 20 years in the game. Yeah, you should say 25-30 point era, because that's what it was. And it's 10 of 20, not 15 of 20. Kareem scored < 25 10 times, 25-30 6 times, and 30 4 times. Michael scored <25 never (except for the injury season), 25-30 4 times, and > 30 8 times (yes, that's twice as often, even though his career wasn't nearly as long). Other than the injury season, the only comparative year that Kareem outscored Michael was the rookie year, when Kareem outscored Michael 28.8 - 28.2. After that, Michael outscored Kareem every year, by a margin ranging from 2.3 to 9.7 (and the margin increased as time went on--Jordan was consistently great; Kareem deteriorated). Kareem's career average was 24.6. Michael never scored that few (his career low was 28.7, aside from the injury season). Michael's career average was 31.5. Kareem scored that many twice (that's 10% of the time). The playoff story is even more pronounced. Yes, his numbers dipped as he got old, but that's not because of showtime. His numbers dropped below 25 several years before Magic was drafted, and only got above 25 once after that. Those are respectable numbers, but they're Karl Malone numbers. They're not Michael Jordan numbers. Kareem was a heckuva player, and probably the best college baller ever, but no Michael. I think that California sun is getting to you. Ardethan, This is a spurious argument. You don't think that Kareem couldn't have scored forty a game if he had wanted to? Throughtout his career, he sacrificed his individual numbers in the goal of a winning team. In a pretty famous story (which he has related countless times in interviews and in print), in Kareem's (or Lew's then) freshman year, Wooden told him that he could win the collegiate scoring championship every year OR win National Championships. But that he couldn't do both. Kareem didn't hesitate in his response. That attitude carried through his career, where he always spread the scoring around and made his teammates better (and remember, he had bigger scorers as teammates than Jordan did, from Magic to Worthy to Jamaal Wilkes to Byron Scott to McAdoo...). Jordan didn't have as many options on his team to score as Kareem did... Kareem's first collegiate game he scored 56 points against usc. He never scored that many points again. Though he could have many times over. Dr.Id@hedidwinmoreMVPsthanJordan.com