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Politics : Sharks in the Septic Tank -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Dayuhan who wrote (20830)	8/7/2001 1:28:14 AM
From: epicure	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 82486

Steven there is an awesome article in this: As the Romans used bread and circuses, so we use welfare and MTV. Of course we have privatized the circuses. That was a good capitalist move, but anathema to conservatives whose fondness for good capitalist moves is outweighed by their shock at the demand-driven content of the private sector circus. That is such an interesting and quirky way to put things. Just wanted to let you know.

To: Dayuhan who wrote (20830)	8/7/2001 1:59:37 AM
From: average joe	Respond to of 82486

If we ask young people to decide whether to have sex or not based on some abstract moral standard, rather than on the basis of enlightened self-interest, is that not equivalent to invoking the spirit of noblesse oblige? A risk/reward assessment is not an abstract moral standard. A child that has good self-esteem is more likely to make good choices and learn from their mistakes. Making mistakes is part of learning and growing, education will help them not make fatal mistakes. Perhaps you've been in a Catholic country too long, decisions regarding sexuality are not the business of the state. I think you err, though, in attributing acts of public or private charity to noblesse oblige. They are more frequently a result of a calculation of enlightened self interest. Common sense tells us that if we create a society in which people are free to succeed or fail, some will fail. While we are free to succeed and fail we also are free to succeed and fail on our own account and expense. If we are continually bailed out we have no incentive to succeed and therefore are not truly free. Private charity has the sanction of the victim and is true Noblesse Oblige. State inspired acts of altruism don't always have the consent of the victim and therefore are not worthy of a free society. Everyone fails in a Welfare State. It reduces everyone in society to the Lowest Common Denominator, gives special status to people who are basically worthless at the expense of those who should be able to enjoy the fruits of their own labor. Experience of human nature tells us that they will inevitably blame their failure on someone else, and get angry. They are free to get angry and blame whoever they want for their failure and their mistakes. It is part of a larger realization process that puts one in touch with his core. It doesn't take an abacus to calculate that it is cheaper to dull their anger with an occasional doleout than it is to deal with the results of undulled anger. I don't care about sawing off their anger. I believe it is bad to strip them of dignity by putting them on the dole. The only thing that gives us dignity and self-worth is work, why would I take that away from my fellow man? I think it is very selfish of you to suggest other wise. As the Romans used bread and circuses, so we use welfare and MTV. Of course we have privatized the circuses. That was a good capitalist move, but anathema to conservatives whose fondness for good capitalist moves is outweighed by their shock at the demand-driven content of the private sector circus. I don't think the circus was ever public so how could it be privatized? MTV is private and the welfare state while public varies from country to country. The consensus shifts from country to country so I'm not sure which "we" you refer to. There are not many "good capitalists" left most of them are on the public dole themselves and rely on hand outs, big lobbying efforts or are so far leveraged as to not be fully independent.