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Gold/Mining/Energy : Canadian REITS, Trusts & Dividend Stocks -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Tommy D who wrote (1437)	9/12/2001 2:05:29 PM
From: Goldberry	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 11633

Personally I would like to see a new subject topic opened up for the oil and gas trusts or use made of the existing one located under Canadian stocks. This topic which was initially set up to cover Canadian REITS seems to have become primarily a discussion on oil and gas trusts. Someone who primarily has an interest in Oil and Gas Trusts should go to the following Subject 50619 and make it an active topic or go to siliconinvestor.com and create a new forum.

To: Tommy D who wrote (1437)	9/12/2001 3:52:53 PM
From: Peter W. Panchyshyn	Respond to of 11633

This used to be a very informative site with various perspectives. ---------------- It still is It is now dominated by your apparent unwillingness to accept any other perspective on the oil & gas trusts -------------- It is not unwillingness to accept other perspectives. It is demanding that people back up what they say with facts and data. Coming here and making a statement like " all trusts are selling gas at losses and huge losses" " the price for natural gas it has dropped from $10 to just under $3 the trusts are looseing money selling gas at huge losses" . " Everybody should bail out of the trusts or dont even consider buying them at such levels." I come out here with information that the trusts are not selling at huge loss, prices were this level and lower before the big run up. Information that can be checked and verified easily enough. Where is the information from the other side that says PGF or any trusts has sold any gas at any loss (below their costs of production). They haven't provided it. What they provide is a chart of prices in US or CDN it doesnt matter but where does it say that a trust sold any there it doesn't. Where's the real loss. They don't even bother to tell people that yes prices were this level and lower years before and the trusts made good money. They don't bother to provide figures of a funds cost of production and how it relates to prices (this I did -- look to post # 1250 the cost of production for PGF and how much PGF earned in the first six months of this year) In regards to a methodology or strategy to use with these trusts. Where has anyone else provided one. Where has anyone else provided references for data used to develop this strategy. Where has anyone said look to the historical data from legitamite sources and then do the math yourself to see if the strategy is not sound. Who else has said check it is all there supported by real data. ME. The other side provides shreds of historical data (5 years). I provide nearly 20 then they say that their 5 years is more indicitive of the trusts than the 20 years I provide. They ask others to believe their statements supported by what they believe what they think what they feel. I say look to the long term data for the trusts from the financial post data group. Look to trust weekly trading data obtainable from even some online brokers or market data providers. Look at these and you will see that what I say is based upon facts. It is the truth. It is the best way to play the trusts. And this forum isn't dominated by me. But I am a huge contributor. And I stress that I am a CONTRIBUTOR. I have not even seen another posting from you here. If you can't or won't participate in this forum. Then don't tell others that do and do to truely convey real information to others. To stop what their doing . IN OTHER WORDS PUT UP (CONTRIBUTE) OR YOU SHUTUP. . I am long term quite positive about the trusts but we are going through some pricing issues at this time, including a dramatic drop off in the price paid for Empress delivered product, which most certainly is stated in Canadian dollars. Give it a rest and let others get back to putting forward their perspectives and thoughts, rather than just your perspective, which is often quite lengthy. --------------- Providing real information is LENGTHY. Making statements not supported by facts is both easy and useless because it doesn't provide the information that others can verify for themselves to make a right decision. Now as far as the pricing question goes. Its one thing to scream losses and huge losses. Its another thing to prove that it is really happening. Again where is the data that say trust A sold at a huge loss or any loss?. Its not there. Where is the cost related to pricing received for the trusts?. Its not there. So more importantly what is the real impact to the trusts, not the imagined.? Its not there. These are all important questions holders of the trusts should be asking and getting answers for. Then and only then can unit holders make the proper investment decisions. Instead people like Lorne think that you others should just listen to him accept what he says as gospel dont ask any pointed questions and make your investment decisions from that. I ask the important questions. I search out what is not being told and I tell it or I demand that others tell it or find it for us. Thats what makes a good discussion. Thats what invokes particpation. Otherwise, the thread will die and that would be unfortunate. --------------- The thread wont die if people contribute and really contribute. Not just read and never partake and then stop by once to complain. Complaining doesn't help one bit. So get up off your ass provide some questions or information or strategy that you can back up or shut up and let the rest of the regulars do what they have been doing. And thats participateing.