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To: tekboy who wrote (46708)9/15/2001 10:00:08 AM
From: gdichaz  Respond to of 54805
 
tekboy: Thanks for helping us learn from the resources you have made available from your "day job" and your experience.

Not easy to deal with this, but the more we have in terms of balance and perspective, the better.

Please keep up the good work.

Best.

Cha2



To: tekboy who wrote (46708)9/15/2001 10:01:08 AM
From: slacker711  Respond to of 54805
 
I havent been able to find confirmation of this story elsewhere...but the Economic Times is a major Indian paper and has been reliable in the past (on much smaller issues).

US marines land in Pakistan for surveillance

economictimes.com

ISLAMABAD
Amid reports of US marines landing in Pakistan for surveillance against the Taliban and terrorist mastermind Osama bin Laden, international airlines have stopped using the Pak-Afghan air corridor and the country's airports have been put on high alert.

The Nation on Saturday reported that a special plane carrying over two dozen foreigners landed at the Chaklala Airbase in the wee hours of Friday.

Another daily The News quoted an eyewitness as saying that he had seen a small contingent of US troops having already landed in Islamabad. It said, according to unofficial reports, a contingent of over 50 personnel from the Special Services Group of the US marines 'Green Seals' have landed for conducting 'target-oriented' operations against Bin Laden.

However, it said there was no official confirmation on this from any quarter. Diplomatic sources confirmed the arrival of two American aircraft but declined to give further details. Heavy Army contingents were deployed to provide security at all airports across the country, including Karachi, Lahore and Islamabad, media reports said.

Unconfirmed reports also said that the Pakistan Air Force was on high alert to guard the country's airspace. The News said the international airlines using its 396-nautical mile air corridor over its airspace that provided the shortest air route to international flights travelling from Far East to Europe, stopped using the corridor. The airlines would now have to take a circuitous route. (PTI)

................................

Just found some possible confirmation....Islmabad airport was shut down for four hours last night.

pakobservercom.readyhosting.com

It takes F-16 only five minutes to reach Kahuta from Sargodha airbase. Well informed sources claimed that in the vee hours of Friday USA has landed its defence personnel and essential military equipment including monitoring systems, radars and equipment to establish a make shift command and control systems somewhere near Pak-Afghan borders. Reports claimed that one of the aircraft that landed at Islamabad airport early Friday can be a reconnaissance aircraft.



To: tekboy who wrote (46708)9/15/2001 4:12:19 PM
From: BirdDog  Read Replies (4) | Respond to of 54805
 
Mylroie's argument--that Saddam is behind ..

Thank you for the further information links.
As for Mylroie. I'll sure take that info with some salt. Wouldn't it also be as prudent to take anything from our own CIA with the same skepticism? After all... we don't want them to know that we know...otherwise our info isn't any good anymore. I would be very interested in anything that Mylroie provided that is false? Was anything in that article false? Or simply left out some facts that apply?

BirdDog



To: tekboy who wrote (46708)9/15/2001 11:22:06 PM
From: stockman_scott  Respond to of 54805
 
Smoking or Non-Smoking?

The New York Times
By THOMAS L. FRIEDMAN
September 14, 2001
FOREIGN AFFAIRS

JERUSALEM -- If this attack on America by an extensive terrorist cell is the equivalent of World War III, it's not too early to begin thinking about what could be its long-term geopolitical consequences. Just as World Wars I and II produced new orders and divisions, so too might this war. What might it look like?

Israel's foreign minister, Shimon Peres, offers the following possibility: Several decades ago, he notes, they discovered that smoking causes cancer. Soon after that, people started to demand smoking and non-smoking sections. "Well, terrorism is the cancer of our age," says Mr. Peres. "For the past decade, a lot of countries wanted to deny that, or make excuses for why they could go on dealing with terrorists. But after what's happened in New York and Washington, now everyone knows. This is a cancer. It's a danger to us all. So every country must now decide whether it wants to be a smoking or non-smoking country, a country that supports terrorism or one that doesn't."

Mr. Peres is on to something — this sort of division is going to emerge — but we must be very, very careful about how it is done, and whom we, the U.S., assign to the smoking and non-smoking worlds.

As Mr. Peres himself notes, this is not a clash of civilizations — the Muslim world versus the Christian, Hindu, Buddhist and Jewish worlds. The real clash today is actually not between civilizations, but within them — between those Muslims, Christians, Hindus, Buddhists and Jews with a modern and progressive outlook and those with a medieval one. We make a great mistake if we simply write off the Muslim world and fail to understand how many Muslims feel themselves trapped in failing states and look to America as a model and inspiration.

"President Lincoln said of the South after the Civil War: 'Remember, they pray to the same God,'" remarked the Middle East analyst Stephen P. Cohen. "The same is true of many, many Muslims. We must fight those among them who pray only to the God of Hate, but we do not want to go to war with Islam, with all the millions of Muslims who pray to the same God we do."

The terrorists who hit the U.S. this week are people who pray to the God of Hate. Their terrorism is not aimed at reversing any specific U.S. policy. Indeed, they made no demands. Their terrorism is driven by pure hatred and nihilism, and its targets are the institutions that undergird America's way of life, from our markets to our military.

These terrorists must be rooted out and destroyed. But it must be done in a way that doesn't make us Osama bin Laden's chief recruiter. Because these Muslim terrorists did not just want to kill Americans. That is not the totality of their mission. These people think strategically. They also want to trigger the sort of massive U.S. retaliation that makes no distinction between them and other Muslims. That would be their ultimate victory — because they do see the world as a clash of civilizations, and they want every Muslim to see it that way as well and to join their jihad.

Americans were really only able to defeat Big Tobacco when whistleblowers within the tobacco industry went public and took on their own industry, and their own bosses, as peddlers of cancer. Similarly, the only chance to really defeat these nihilistic terrorists is not just by bombing them. That is necessary, but not sufficient, because another generation will sprout up behind them. Only their own religious communities and societies can really restrain and delegitimize them. And that will happen only when the Muslim majority recognizes that what the Osama bin Ladens are leading to is the destruction and denigration of their own religion and societies.

This civil war within Islam, between the modernists and the medievalists, has actually been going on for years — particularly in Egypt, Algeria, Saudi Arabia, Jordan and Pakistan. We need to strengthen the good guys in this civil war. And that requires a social, political and economic strategy, as sophisticated, and generous, as our military one.

To not retaliate ferociously for this attack on our people is only to invite a worse attack tomorrow and an endless war with terrorists. But to retaliate in a way that doesn't distinguish between those who pray to a God of Hate and those who pray to the same God we do is to invite an endless war between civilizations — a war that will land us all in the smoking section.