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Politics : Idea Of The Day -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Thomas M. who wrote (40687)	9/23/2001 11:45:42 AM
From: Jeff Jordan	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 50167

>>>>the "Great Satan" <<<< Is a myth, a sound bite. Hate is the "great satan" They don't fear satan (because they are in league with him, you can tell by their actions) when they should be fearing the one true God! Allah, Johavah,Ar-Rahim, Elohim, Lord, Adonai, Yahweh, Al-Aziz, The Almighty, in contrast to God,Allah,Yahweh: satan shaytan strong man murderer liar and father of lies ruler of the world god of this world heb..."abbadon lucifer serpent the wicked one the destroyer adversary the evil one tempter the deceiver angel of death It's easy to see whom a person worships because their nature is revealed in their actions. There are many holy places in the world only God can judge who is righteous in their hearts and deserve his blessings and grace. Man doesn't defile the earth because of his presence God put us here. If anything the earth has defiled Man since we came from it. man has created many religions not of god and has done great sin and evil in His name. No matter what their rhetoric/justification is they are known by their acts and deeds. Like they say: One can't serve two masters. There is way too much pride in the world and not enough forgiveness,compassion and love. JMO on the big picture, but that's really the essence of the problem, the battle of good vs evil continues to the end. Or is it a really a battle for our souls? I fear no evil or death.....JJ

To: Thomas M. who wrote (40687)	9/23/2001 2:45:49 PM
From: j g cordes	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 50167

Thomas.. you said "Bin Laden hates us because we are AGAINST freedom and democracy.. (in Saudi Arabia)" Its wonderful to have an instinct for contrary thinking.. but on this you're missing the point completely. Yes America acts first in its own economic interest. To that end it supports friendly regimes even when they aren't democratic. But the author wasn't arguing the consistency of American foreign policy as a cause of fundamentalism's failure or Bin Laden's homicidal actions. No, the writer is saying "This is a war of ideas. Traditionalism vs. Modernism, Totalitarianism vs. Pluralism, Dogma vs. Dissent. What makes this war worth fighting is not vengeance. It is the human desire for freedom. " ".. totalitarian theocracies," not democracies, are standing in the way of a Renaissance among Islamic countries. Sure, Bin Laden says he's fighting against foreigners trespassing and says he's fighting against the Saudi regime supported by an evil America, but he never says he's fighting for freedom and democracy... nor do I presume you'd choose to live within the Afghani/Taliban system of government that he has some influence in shaping.

To: Thomas M. who wrote (40687)	9/23/2001 5:06:20 PM
From: SirRealist	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 50167

Bin Laden hates us because we are AGAINST freedom and democracy. His 96 Declaration of War against the US states his opposition is based on the words of Mohammed in not permitting a non-believer to make any claim to the Arabian peninsula, so opposition to US bases there is his STATED reason. The Taliban came into power fighting the Soviets with enormous backing by Palestine and its ISI; losing that support is likely the biggest surprise they've sustained thus far. Bin Laden was one of several that we funded as part of the $2B we contributed to the anti-Soviet resistance. He had no prob taking money and weapons from Satan to fight to keep Afghanistan free. Calling him supportive of 'democratic' anything is a stretch. He wants Islam to dominate the world, may believe it is pre-ordained, and clearly thinks he's just the super-prophet to lead them to that. He hates. He is well-educated enough to understand that most Americans want freedom and democracy, even if our govt screws up from time to time. Support for the Shah? Old history. Even most Iranians don't carry that grudge anymore. Perhaps he does bear a grudge against Saudi royalty, but it's hard to fathom due to his family's long intermingling of assets and business with that royalty. Or are you suggesting 6400 dead, most civilians, from 42 countries around the globe is the work of a freedom & democracy lover? I've read a lot of history and can find no parallel of anyone expressing such noble aims via such cruelty as he has unleashed.