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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: CountofMoneyCristo who wrote (1541)	9/27/2001 1:42:19 PM
From: Frederick Langford	Respond to of 281500

Very sad indeed Count, very sad indeed. Fred

To: CountofMoneyCristo who wrote (1541)	9/27/2001 5:41:16 PM
From: SirRealist	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

The Netherlands is one of the most tolerant nations anywhere. Agreed. Yet a full history of the Dutch, in colonial America and South Africa, and elsewhere, yields a different picture. The Dutch have been brutal and repressive, though admittedly, in the past. I make this point because OBL & the Taliban have repeatedly asserted the US is bad because of slavery and Hiroshima. There's no doubt that our history contains stains we'd like to get rid of (and please, no debates on Hiroshima's validity, as they miss my point here). Who we have been helps us to decide who we will become. Errors made 55 and 135 years ago are not mirrors of who we are today, and we cannot be made guilty for the acts of ancestors long dead. That debt is paid by learning from those past errors and evolving towards a more civil society, as we've done rather successfully. So have the Dutch. Those who attack civilization now mirror the ancestors who committed great errors. Choosing that course makes them culpable, much more than those of us who observed, shuddered at the inhumanity, and evolved in our civil behaviors.

To: CountofMoneyCristo who wrote (1541)	9/27/2001 5:41:16 PM
From: SirRealist	Respond to of 281500

The Netherlands is one of the most tolerant nations anywhere. Agreed. Yet a full history of the Dutch, in colonial America and South Africa, and elsewhere, yields a different picture. The Dutch have been brutal and repressive, though admittedly, in the past. I make this point because OBL & the Taliban have repeatedly asserted the US is bad because of slavery and Hiroshima. There's no doubt that our history contains stains we'd like to get rid of (and please, no debates on Hiroshima's validity, as they miss my point here). Who we have been helps us to decide who we will become. Errors made 55 and 135 years ago are not mirrors of who we are today, and we cannot be made guilty for the acts of ancestors long dead. That debt is paid by learning from those past errors and evolving towards a more civil society, as we've done rather successfully. So have the Dutch. Those who attack civilization now mirror the ancestors who committed great errors. Choosing that course makes them culpable, much more than those of us who observed, shuddered at the inhumanity, and evolved in our civil behaviors.