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Politics : Sharks in the Septic Tank -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: J. C. Dithers who wrote (30797)	10/3/2001 2:51:47 PM
From: Poet	Respond to of 82486

Hi JC, What a pleasure to see you out and about! I'm sure Bill will enjoy corresponding with you when he gets home tonight. Be well.

To: J. C. Dithers who wrote (30797)	10/3/2001 6:48:38 PM
From: E	Respond to of 82486

They were American citizens, most of those 120,000 ethnic Japanese. Who were given a few days to clear out and get locked up, under guard by armed soldiers, forcing everyone to sell all their worldly goods to their lucky and no less guilty caucasian neighbors, for nothing, pennies, or to abandon it all to predation. It was a disgraceful episode in our nation's history, and I think there is more dignity in admitting it than it rationalizing it by citing mass hysteria as a mitigating factor. You write, "everything I heard was totally supportive of quarantining the J-As on the west coast." It's not surprising. The Hearst papers were especially influential, printing propaganda and fabricating stories. See link below. Did you know that Attorney General Francis Biddle and F.B.I. director J. Edgar Hoover opposed the internments? This is also highly relevant to how 'supportive' the facts were: The U.S. government had been secretly conducting studies on the West Coast population of Japanese for ten years; and in November 1941, at President Roosevelt's request, Curtis B. Munson prepared a 25 page report on their loyalty. He reached the same conclusion the F.B.I. and Naval Intelligence had-- that the Japanese Americans were exceptionally trustworthy and posed no danger to the country. Immediately after the Pearl Harbor bombing the government was seized by a kind of panic. 1,291 Japanese American community leaders were arrested, including publishers, church officials, and schoolteachers. A thousand more were seized in the next two months. Nothing was ever proven against these men; in fact, not one was ever charged... These internment camps were ramshackle productions located in the middle of nowhere. Often, the evacuees were made to live in dilapidated army barracks or horse stables... often entire families of eight or more people lived in the same room... The food was scanty and many people suffered from malnutrition.... inertia23.net

To: J. C. Dithers who wrote (30797)	10/3/2001 6:54:02 PM
From: E	Respond to of 82486

A post script from the same link: In the beginning of 1943, the 442d Regimental Combat team was created for service in Europe. Over 18,000 Japanese American men served with the 442d, and it became the most decorated unit of its size in the war. 18,143 decorations were awarded to members of the 442d, and word of their bravery and loyalty gradually helped to change American feelings. Another 15,000 were employed by the military as nurses and translators. If the government ever needed proof of the degree to which these young people had become Americanized, it was amply demonstrated here: many required special training by the Army to regain proficiency in the Japanese language. Why is it that my grandparents, who were of German descent, weren't disturbed? What about Italian-Americans? The Attorney General and the FBI director of the time were right. That should not have happened. inertia23.net

To: J. C. Dithers who wrote (30797)	10/3/2001 7:09:16 PM
From: E	Respond to of 82486

Here are some relevant quotes from the time: "The Los Angeles Times editorialized that "[a] viper is nonetheless a viper wherever the egg is hatched – so a Japanese American, born of Japanese parents – grows up to be a Japanese, not an American." ... Gen. DeWitt held similar views, and would later state before Congress that "[y]ou needn't worry about the Italians[sic, Italian Americans] at all except in certain cases. Also, the same for the Germans [sic, German Americans] except in individual cases.But we must worry about the Japanese [American] all the time until he is wiped off the map." Also, as I posted earlier: "...neither FBI Director J. Edgar Hoover nor United States Attorney General Francis Biddle felt the threat of sabotage or espionage was a legitimate concern. They felt the relocation to be the result simply of local political pressures... " BTW, this is an oddity: "it is noteworthy that there was no mass internment/relocation of Japanese Americans living in the Hawaiian Islands, despite the imposition there of martial law. Of the more than 150,000 persons of Japanese ancestry living in Hawaii, only about 1,500 were interned (generally, "for cause," I would guess)."" cynthialeitichsmith.com

To: J. C. Dithers who wrote (30797)	10/3/2001 7:13:06 PM
From: E	Respond to of 82486

"The FBI quickly began rounding up any and all "suspicious" Japanese for internment. None was ever charged with any crime. Almost all were simply Japanese community leaders, Buddhist or Shinto priests, newspaper editors, language or Judo instructors, or labor organizers. The Japanese community leadership was liquidated in one quick operation. Men were taken away without notice. Most families knew nothing about why their men had suddenly disappeared, to where they were taken, or when they would be released. Some arrestees were soon let free, but most were secretly shipped to internment camps around the country. Some families learned what had happened to their men only several years later. The action also included the freezing of bank accounts, seizure of contraband, drastic limitation on travel, curfew and other severely restrictive measures. But this FBI operation merely set the stage for the mass evacuation to come...." ihr.org

To: J. C. Dithers who wrote (30797)	10/3/2001 7:18:26 PM
From: E	Respond to of 82486

"Posters appeared the length of the West Coast ordering the Japanese to evacuation points. "Instructions to all persons of JAPANESE ancestry," read the bold headline on a typical poster. The text read: "All Japanese persons, both alien and non-alien, will be evacuated from the above designated areas by 12:00 o'clock noon Tuesday, April 7, 1942." The evacuees were told to report for internment with bedrolls and only as much baggage as could be carried by hand. (A postwar survey showed that 80 percent of the privately stored goods belonging to the interned Japanese were "rifled, stolen or sold during absence.")... The rationale for the West Coast evacuation was "military necessity." But that claim was inconsistent with the fact that the Japanese living on Hawaii were not subject to mass incarceration. Hawaii was in far greater danger of invasion than the West Coast. The population of Hawaii was 38 percent Japanese, as compared to only about one percent in California. All except a small percentage of the Hawaiian Japanese remained free to keep the important island economy functioning. ihr.org

To: J. C. Dithers who wrote (30797)	10/3/2001 7:25:10 PM
From: E	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 82486

The evacuation, ostensibly to protect against possible sabotage and espionage, moreover included babies, orphans, adopted children, and the infirm or bedridden elderly. Children of mixed blood, even from orphanages, were included if they had any Japanese ancestry at all. Colonel Karl Bendetsen, who directly administered the program, declared: "I am determined that if they have one drop of Japanese blood in them, they must go to camp." ihr.org As you can see, J.C., I am deeply ashamed of this episode in our nation's history and can't bear to see it rationalized (I know there is a rationalization industry out there) without offering at least some of the available evidence that it was just motivated by exactly what The FBI director and the Attorney General said it was motivated by: politics.

To: J. C. Dithers who wrote (30797)	10/4/2001 7:30:51 PM
From: St_Bill	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 82486

There is so much I don't understand. Your'e arguing that in retrospect what we did to Japanese Americans was wrong but at the time, understandable. I think I do understand our behavior. I also think we created more misery than is generally known and that if we knew more about what we did to these people we might find it less excusable? Those camps were nothing like Bergin-Beltzin I know. Still Nevertheless, On the morning of 9/11 I remember standing beside the enormous boat I was working on, listening to the radio broadcasting news of the first collapse and thinking outloud that this must have been what it was like to hear about Pearl Harbor. A popular question has been whether that comparison or analogy makes sense. In some ways it certainly doesn't and this you point out. I explained this to my wife -- that in 1941 we were attacked by a country that had a bigger army, navy (who had figured out that battle ships weren't all they were cracked up to be) and air force than we. The Taliban is not so well-equipped. It seems clear to me that we should not round up all Arab-Americans. And this, I think, remains clear to most people.But is this because the situation is different or that we have changed since Pearl Harbor? And if we have changed, Are we better now or worse?