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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Maurice Winn who wrote (4614)	10/12/2001 5:32:27 PM
From: Ilaine	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

That's all very interesting, Mq, but it's completely beside the point. Your post that Hawk and I responded to was about free speech vs. censorship during wartime. Nobody cast any aspersions on the military service of New Zealand, nor the bravery of its military. I am bemused by the concept that someone who lives in a country somehow becomes a courageous, noble person because he has courageous, noble countrymen, or a courageous, noble father. I don't think it works like that. I also don't think someone from a country full of cowardly, ignoble people is, ipso facto, a cowardly, ignoble person. People stand or fall on their own merits, IMO. (Parenthetically, I wonder why you flew into such a towering dudgeon over things which are really trivial. What I said - and I think it's true - you, personally, live in New Zealand, not the United States, and are not in harm's way. For you the newsworthiness of a story would easily outweigh the risk. My assumption is that Hawk assumed that you live in the US, and he was appealing to your respect and concern for the safety and security of your fellow countrymen. There's no insult there that I can perceive.) As for the allegation that my friends sponsor terrorism, I have a lot of friends - and two of them have contributed to the IRA, which I do not condone. To the best of my knowledge that's the extent of it - although I was friends with a Nicaraguan once who was in favor of the Sandinistas. Haven't seen him in years.

To: Maurice Winn who wrote (4614)	10/12/2001 5:34:53 PM
From: FaultLine	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

Maurice Winn, I not quite sure where you are coming from, but Hawk was referring to making the enemy die, not our friends. If that indeed is your misunderstanding, please back off as I carefully explained this to everyone yesterday. Message 16492498 Now as far as your CB remarks, I have no idea what that was all about, but it sounded very rude to me. You must understand, Rudness is always Off-Topic on this board (and I define what is "rude"). Now I value your contributions, but in the future, please check your temper at the door. Thank you, --FaultLine

To: Maurice Winn who wrote (4614)	10/12/2001 6:47:09 PM
From: Normandi	Respond to of 281500

Maurice Thank you for your post #4614, it was right on. Cheers ~Norm

To: Maurice Winn who wrote (4614)	10/12/2001 7:28:38 PM
From: Hawkmoon	Respond to of 281500

Your gratuitous comment about 12,000 New Zealand soldiers who went to fight for freedom and civilization as far from home as it's possible to go should embarrass you. Maurice baby.... you need to lighten up... I have NOTHING BUT RESPECT for the ANZAC troops who fought in WWII, or any other war for that matter. My flippant comment was more directed to the incredibly inept British leadership under which they often fought which needlessly sacrificed such fine men. The fact that a greater percentage of New Zealanders died in combat than did US troops is irrelevant. Because no matter how brave and tough you are, if your leadership, strategy, and equipment stink, you're going to lose. And that's not the fault of the Kiwis. In fact, one of my favorite movies of all time is Gallipoli. Granted, it's about Aussies, but it makes my point very well. It's a tribute to American strategy that we are willing to suffer the short-term heavy casualities if it creates fluidity on the battlefield where our superior mobility and airpower can prevent the enemy from reconstituing his defenses. If the US had fought the Normandy campaign in the manner Montgomery did, WWII would not have ended until 1946, and the Russians would likely have occupied all of Germany while we were still trying to get across France. Montgomery was unwilling to risk lives until he had overwhelming superiority to the enemy But that's being penny wise and pound foolish.. The fact that he failed to clear the Scheldt Estuary and forced Ike to direct all supplies to him for Market-Garden, left Patton high and dry just when the door was open for him to get a bridgehead across the Rhine by October-November, 1944. And for the effort, he wound up losing an entire paratroop division, and a good part of a Polish paratroop brigade, as well as failing to achieve his primary objective. expage.com Btw, if I had anywhere else to live other than the US, it would likely be New Zealand or Australia. So get a grip and practice up on your english comprehension skills. Have a good weekend now... Hawk