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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Raymond Duray who wrote (7728)	10/27/2001 4:55:41 AM
From: Bilow	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

Hi Raymond Duray; I loved the alleged Arafat post, [(On going to war over religion) - "You're basically killing each other to see who's got the better imaginary friend.] but it's too funny, and I have trouble believing he said it. In fact, I had so much trouble believing it that I did a quick web search and concluded it was said by Richard Jeni, who's a comedian of some renown: He also said: "Honesty is the key to a relationship. If you can fake that, you're in." dailyjokes.com.au There are also attributions of the above quote to David Ben Gurion, but I doubt he said it either. It's rather blasphemous: stumps.org Re: "You seem to be a good apologist for the arms industry." The problem with disarming completely is that the world has not yet become completely safe for democracy. But the trend is definitely in our favor. Funny how war changes everything. On September 10th, we were having our usual little low level pissing matches with the EU over esoteric trade issues, one day later we're staunch allies. And this time is much less dangerous than WW1 or WW2. The entire industrialized world is on the same side now. Re: "Since I'd rather see us build a utopian future where inequality and poverty are eliminated, I'd say that I'm in a distinct minority of idealists who just don't see the point of all our deliberate attempts to create ever better ways to kill each other." The US did a pretty good job creating a "utopia" in the places it occupied after WW2. In that sense, a piece of territory was lucky to get completely and totally crushed by us. The places which we've just kicked around (like Iraq), as opposed to occupying and rebuilding haven't done so well. In this sense, a U.S. commitment to "bear any burden" in Afghanistan may be a kindness. Overall, the world situation (as measured by literacy, average life span, and child survival rates) has improved over the past 25 years in the vast majority of the countries on it. Scientific American had a set of maps showing the differences between 1975 and 2000, and it was stunning. This world is getting wealthy. And on average, it is becoming more peaceful as well. -- Carl

To: Raymond Duray who wrote (7728)	10/27/2001 6:42:01 AM
From: Ilaine	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

>>You seem to be a good apologist for the arms industry<< Somebody has to do it. We need soldiers, like we need cops and we need firemen. Bad stuff happens. I am keeping mental score and so far I haven't read any "give peace a chance" stuff coming out of New Yawk. Funny how things change. I wouldn't wish it on anyone, but I suspect that if the bad guys were doing things in your neighborhood, you'd be singing a different tune.

To: Raymond Duray who wrote (7728)	10/27/2001 10:48:04 AM
From: Hawkmoon	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

the only thing that human beings do with more destructive weaponry is engage in..... more destruction. I'll remember that the next time I fly on a commercial airliner near a skyscraper. Hawk

To: Raymond Duray who wrote (7728)	10/27/2001 12:02:14 PM
From: Selectric II	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

Since I'd rather see us build a utopian future where inequality and poverty are eliminated, I'd say that I'm in a distinct minority of idealists who just don't see the point of all our deliberate attempts to create ever better ways to kill each other. Do you believe in self defense against those who would kill you and have already stated their intention? Apparently not. O.K., I nominate you to be our process server to serve legal papers on bin Laden, Omar, and friends. I'll chip in to help pay for your plane ticket. Be sure to appeal to their idealism when convincing them to take the papers and show up for trial.