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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Carolyn who wrote (7806)	10/27/2001 8:42:45 PM
From: 49thMIMOMander	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

<Why can't people believe that September 11 was stunning, unexpected, unwarranted, unacceptable, evil? > No problem, but the pressure had been building for a long time. What is that often quoted "evil"??? Evil this and Evil that, what does it really mean?? Ilmarinen Picking up on the UK emperial and coloninial stuff was obviously not easy, but USA actually collected a lot of points then, please do not waste all of them.

To: Carolyn who wrote (7806)	10/27/2001 9:18:01 PM
From: Hawkmoon	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

Well Carolyn... there are always certain groups like Unocal which stand to benefit from US overthrowing the Taleban and the oil argument has some minimal validity.. But it's also valid that Afghanistan is so poor that such a source of national income should be welcomed. After all, they are just providing transit rights, and it's not like we're stealing their natural resources and exporting them to our economy. But you are quite correct. Bin Laden is in Afghanistan, and that's where we have to root him out from. If he were still in Somalia, someone would be arguing that we were their trying to manipulate oil rights or shipping routes... That's why arguments like Raymond's must be further analyzed to see if they hold water as being the primary rationale for why US troops are involved. We can see an example of this in Kuwait. We claimed we were there to preserve international law and prevent tyranny... but no one can argue that, had not the majority of the world's oil flowed from there, we likely would still be engaging in some UN condemnation and economic sanctions, rather than military action. But Raymond is correct also that certain administrations have bowed to corporate pressure to take political actions in certain countries (United Fruit) Hawk

To: Carolyn who wrote (7806)	10/27/2001 10:35:46 PM
From: Raymond Duray	Read Replies (4) \| Respond to of 281500

Why can't people believe that September 11 was stunning, unexpected, unwarranted, unacceptable, evil? Umm, because it isn't true? Here's why: emergency.com Interestingly, the actual report nssg.gov has been taken off the Web. You will have to be the judge if it is because some agents of the secret government don't want the American public to understand the game that is afoot, or if it is because of a prudent concern that national interests might be compromised if a group of crazies might start studying the report in order to learn how to create terror incidents. I'm inclined to think the terrorists already had a pretty good clue as to how to do their business. BWTFDIK? Re: How can you say such a thing!! Really! If we had designs on Afghanistan (choke) of the Unocal kind, it would have been self-evident from long ago. Well, dear, because it's true. Lots of people have had their eye on Afghanistan for centuries. Is this news to you? If so, you really needed a private school education. If not, shame on you for prevaricating and dissembling. For those who would like to pursue the topic, an excellent recent book on the subject is "Tournament of Shadows" amazon.com by Carl Meyer. I loved reading about the so-called First Afghan War. Talk about a myopic, imperialistic view of the world. This was the first time the British tried to impose their will on Afghanistan. In 1839, 12,000 British and allied soldiers marched on Kabul. In 1842, one British soldier escaped. Carolyn, all I can say is that you are either hopelessly naive or a dissembler. Which is it? Sept. 11 was an answer to American hubris and superciliousness. Don't you get it? -R.