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Politics : Idea Of The Day -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: sripad who wrote (41240)10/28/2001 12:55:38 PM
From: BubbaFred  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 50167
 
<< ...wait and see how these huge american aid and other countries aid in billions will be used in the next 2 years >>

We'll find out and it may not be pleasant. Part of it could be for modenizing the armaments to today's state of the arts standards. What will become to the older weapons??? That's the biggest question. Siphoned off to the Taleban gang ??? Possibility is higher than not.



To: sripad who wrote (41240)10/28/2001 1:34:41 PM
From: IQBAL LATIF  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 50167
 
For you a snake for me a lion.. it is a question of your angle of view!!! Mine is different, with all due respect Sir,

First my commiserations for failure of our friends not to be able to play any meaningful role in the region and just be idle bystanders, I can see the reasons of this ‘snake bitterness’ all around in Indian press and in your nice rejoinder.

I can understand the frustrations of big clout where limelight has been stolen by a minor player but such is life, our geography demands that kind of attention to details and our relationships with the Muslim world is that added bonus where another fundo country can only be pulverized through our bases not Indian’s, you would not do it any way due to your habit to play both sides of the ball game, you were in bed with Russia for all those years when we fought them and now you had this great opportunity to get us which fortunately our diplomacy beat you hands down.

You would play both sides like you do with Israel to get us vis a vis Arab gird and are dearest friends of Arafat in back set together having secrets rendezvous with Arabs to get as many workers you can in Arab world at cheapest possible rates i.e. 100$ a month no question asked slavery 18 hours a day, your country provides all that canon fodder of human beings which is insulted, kicked and hidden by the Arabs to play both sides of the field. We now should go ahead and make our independent approaches with Israel as we have no problems with them and this will most probably a collateral benefit of this gauntlet the mullahs threw to Musharraf and he picked on it, the mullah power will be challenged now the propaganda that Pakistan is a ‘talebinsed state’ could not have been won with billons. If we come out of it clean present propaganda will die and we will be
On course to become a better country hopefully, of course our strength is your strength as a stronger Pakistan will be a guarantee of security for northern Indian but it does make you a smaller player in the region not that India with Security council ambitiousness cannot see the advantage of security over hegemonic huge out of proportion designs.
, I can understand those frustrations, but I will tell you that SC seat is good for nations only when 139 m people do not sleep in gutters or severs.

He is no snake, if he is one he is cobra that most of you worship!! He is a honest man have learned his lessons and in Agra morning breakfast made a mourning breakfast for your editors by telling India that we have no problems as far as you remove the inequities in Kashmir. Powell added insult to that injury by acknowledging that it is a disputed subject. The terrorisms part of it we al condemn we are unanimous but political grandstanding and viciousness to undo Pakistan role in this is very disturbing. He has today told you to talk also told you as a nation in this conflict to lay off. Just
let us live and watch as we take this to conclusive end, we have the muscle and political grip that brings the Saudis to us, the Chinese and the Turks, you are in bed with Iran and Russian and have your now road map that unfortunately is not our roadmap of Bush and Powell so far, may be later but no one remains un hedge in that part of the world where 2.5 billon people confluence meets on the plains of Hindukush tar Himalayas and the Karakoram ranges. .

This is your opinion, Kargil as I have said when it all started that it was wrong but so was the attempt to take Siachin and you took it, so was your efforts to take Hyderabad Deccan and Junagadh and you took it, so was Goa. If Hindu Maharaja of a Muslim dominated Kashmir made the right decision to join Kashmir with India as per instrument of paramountancy, I would have respected that as ‘legalistic’ although moral wrong stance if India would have respected than the wishes of Muslim Maharaja of Junagadh a Hindu dominated state to take his state to Pakistan, why was that state militarily annexed? You cannot just keep throwing stones on others when was the last time you saw anything wrong with your policies and at this juncture critical for my nation I will drop my guard not to indulge in this treacherous debate and answer your queries with historical references, you just answer this question and Kargil will be understood by you, Kargil is that ambitious unwarranted although deceitful answer to hegemony efforts where Indian wants to act as big brother, we are not ready for that kind of relationship, you know in 1972 you introduced nuclear weapons in the region, you never thought that Pakistan is capable of making needles would be able to make any dent in your hegemony role and regional power countering China, we have no ambition to see your role being cut as you have publicly declared China as your enemy number 1, but we have our own reasons to progress and our progress have to come by maintaining a deterrence in face of your threats that is every day living phenomenon for ever Pakistani, your actions on Kashmir are to be resolved by UN resolutions you just don’t accept that and naturally that is my reason not to be supportive of your course to keep condemning my country by agreeing with you, I haven noticed that my generosity of condemning my nation rarely gets acknowledged rather now it is a fashion to ask for more from Ike. Give me some solid answers instead of rhetoric on snake mentality on Kashmir, Junagadh, lets not go and look to biblical times or times of Mehmud Ghaznavi who ravaged our society lets look at present UN that resolution you never talk about, you took the case to UN now you say that everyone is happy lets get them to vote on right of self determination as you have agreed what is your problem on that?

Answer this straight and clear, that binding resolution is the key to stop the violence that has gripped our two societies, much as you like every thing to be resolved I tell you that I am happy that terrorism wile be rooted out but the pressure that India is the most democratic society and need not to worry about the Kashmir issue is gone, you will have to agree on a ‘vote’, you like it or not now that one way propaganda that Pakistan is failed about to fragment on becoming Yugoslavia nonsense will have to go, now I can appreciate that a nation that has cultivated that kind of image for their neighbors painstakingly over last several years thanks our own foolishness and our own inabilities to break that hostage bond with Islam so far has made this fragmentation- implosion policy India’s corner stone strategy is having a difficult time with the summersault that has make your diplomacy look like a ‘idiotic diplomacy’ at its best.

This hangover needs some time to overcome and this anger needs to be stemmed otherwise you will burn yourself. In nations and in diplomacy there are interests and no hard and fast rules that governs nation, so far we in Pakistan were working with our ideologues, no more we have now knows that poverty can only be addressed if we a are part of the civilized worlds like India is and we have corrected out action and you say that the snake shouldn’t be trusted, someone who has put his whole personnel life and stability of our country at stake has not to be trusted because of long standing reckoned deputed issues with your country that are at the fore of our mutual relationship. No one is going to buy that and you will only increase the bridge between Pakistan and India.

If you are right and as you have said majority like India you will be probably successful but lets give that ‘vote’ a chance prove your democratic credentials with that long awaited tryst with the UN resolutions, as Nehru would have put it.

We are growing. We have a window of opportunity and at this junction we are coping with the opportunity to correct this myopic watch on all the parts of our nation that has given so far world leaders a point to think that Pakistan was a Mongol state, we are working hard to rejoin the world community and we want to become part of the part of the civilized state, that is a biggest positive that I see as collateral benefit from this present policy of my government.

By 197 Pakistan acquired a bomb. That we based on centrifuge technology of Uranium enrichment which was not with China or North Korea your peaceful nuclear blasts in 1972 and May of 1998 made our region very precarious, now that Pakistani called your bluff and caught you with pants down there was with benefit of hindsight no need to nuclear peaceful explosions in 1972 or 198 we need to have our poverty addressed, we don’t need to have that false pride of greatness that is none, with Poe very impugned on our faces we cannot live with these nice little disco images where once we land we are hit with poverty on scale unprecedented even in ghettos of Rio.


Snake and trusting is something a very strange analogy, it was in Agra that your government trusted this 'snake' for 3 days. So you have to trust this snake and your Pm will meet this snake in NY as every other world leader is now going to Pakistan as they have now seen through the propaganda that Pakistan is a big a democracy and have the press who can have thread discussions on government policy. Honestly this has been the day that no one but moderate Pakistan has won; it was hidden under relentless propaganda of our enemies, now people world over can see that it is a state that has its problem with India and that is based on right of self determination of people who want a right to vote like you have. Why do you need your 600,000 soldiers as I have said earlier on a ‘flower throwing mission’ are they making love with Kashmiris? I will be honest, your nation tried their best to give the US everything they wanted on 13th Sept and beat the hell out of Pakistan and balkanized it, your government just miserably failed in your efforts and I tell you that even moderates like me who are proud of our ‘Indian descent not Arab’ can see this as a huge betrayal to get us. Please watch the press conference of Powell on 13th and look and listen carefully to the questions by Indian journalists to get us, they were silenced by Powell naturally Powell and Bush are not liked like Clinton who was shown the “Star TV’ India that has no comparison to massive inequities, massive poverty that shocks and depravity that humiliates everyone, my mother came from India in 1947 I could not be more grateful to God for that migration where two of maternal uncles were killed many others lost their lives but w fared better in a beggar Pakistan than a rich India that has inequalities that shame humanity on caste system and poverty that goes with the ‘socialist rendezvous of your leadership for 50 years that resulted infamous ‘Hindu growth rate term in economics.

Hopefully this time we will make our county even better, a South Korea, we have far better standard of living in Pakistan and we were not struck up with misplaced love of USSR for 50 years, neither we sided with them, nor we are in vain glory of a great past that was nothing but depraved sense of creation of castes where human being born free were subject to extreme poverty by giving them a stigma of untouchables on birth that is still hunts 150 million people, the concept of ‘sati’ that lets burn a woman that is honored as religious by country courts, we talk of oppression of Islam but oppression of Hinduism is equally great when it is practiced and the believer deliver it to make it a part of the society that results into what India is today.

I condemn the former but will have no problems in telling you that I also feel bad as being from untouchable past as I must have been one who was forcefully converted by the bandits like Ghnaznvi but I feel like freeing all of those 150 million untouchables from chains of poverty that have made them miserable behind an image that glossy but life is worthless once you scratch the surface a little deep, for me real greatness for nay society is to make things work for our populace, you demanded me the explanation for Pakistan I have blackened this pangs and speed millions of bandwidth on the cyber space but to let you not answer what I feel is very inconsiderate one- up-man-ship is something that I will not let go.

I see so many things wrong with my country and I express them, it is shocking to see that poverty of monumental proportions in your country where 120 m people have no home only 'Jhoppar patties' is hidden in the name of secularism. Bombay walk is a nightmarish walk when you see millions sleeping on streets, a 500$ dinner and a walk that will trample on sleeping human being on roads go to gather, that poverty is failure of everything that is human and a gross insult to humanity. I have spent my little useless life in search of absolute truth there is none, we all are prisoners of our caged believes but in present time I support my government to the hilt as in my opinion a fragmented broken politically divisive stand will derail this coalition and that is not sound thinking, your expediency is appreciated and I can give you great marks for your hatred of my President but I will tell you that all of this is making you look like a ‘sour grapes’ fox. The last rejoinder will be that India is no US, today only 30,000 are walking to wards Afghanistan if India makes an attempt on us it will be millions and I assure you that your political pundits are taking due notice of all this.. Peace and recognition of Pakistan ability to hold the balance of north will do India wonders, I hope that pragmatics in your country will take note of that, loving them will create a better future for all of us, cultivating bad and trying to bad mouth us will fall on deaf ears as you may have noticed now that 20 years of propaganda on ‘talebinisations’ goes to gutters as Pakistan made the ‘righteist of decision’ which any other Arab, Iranian or Muslim state could not, first for no -alls second they had no muscled to deliver we have both and US knows it well. The implosion never came; the president is holding the cards and the murder of Christians will be dealt more aggressively than ritualistic murders of Muslims by these extremists, this is an tempt to create a schism and can be an organized attempt by those who want this coalition good public image being further damaged. I hate to refer to what happened in Indian Gujrat where of Churches brunt by your extremists, our extremists have no more long long road to run, our corrective path should be admired not compared with snake that has no loyalty as snake is a snake. A snake heads need to be crushed at the moment I dare not think of my President as snake as my head will be crushed so would be the fate of this coalition effort supported by 50 nations but actually only by US- UK and Pakistan practically as a satellite state doing what it can. Others are only standing idly and passing judgments, to fight evil needs consistency and relentless efforts that is in plenty supply with Musharraf in present case, he is lion not a snake. Our exports are dead, our imports are heavily prized due to war premiums, our air space we need 18 hours until we get an OK from US forces once they return from bases in Afghanistan, are intelligence completely at US disposal our national bases protected by thousands of people and we are in hot pursuit as US is after Omar, he will not escape that will be the grandest moment for all of us in Pakistan. Not because we took revenge but because justice was delivered and dare no next time ‘no one does that to others’ that is the message to everyone around. Snakes don’t do that, they hide in their holes like many are watching but making lip service on the inabilities of the coalition but when the moment will come than you will realize that this is not snake business this is business of man with vision, courage and attitude. Respect it if you can otherwise your judgment will be questioned like I am doing. My best regards as always..