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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Dayuhan who wrote (11600)	11/26/2001 4:49:36 AM
From: axial	Respond to of 281500

Hi, Steven - I agree very much with your comments.The problem is that the wrapper these injustices and perceived injustices come in, is theistic. Or, as you say, "Islam is simply a binding factor for resentments that have nothing to do with religion." I can suppose a case where the indigenous peoples of North America could embrace real injustices, too - and embark on an effort to destroy the world that destroyed theirs. From the viewpoint of "justice" and "injustice", such actions would probably be entirely acceptable, from the standpoint of the bin Ladens of the world. Let's go a step further: let's imagine the case of a non-indigenous people, global in existence, who have been systematically persecuted, brutally murdered by the millions, and whose existence has been under continuous attack since their state was formed. Let's call them, oh, I don't know...Jews. Without going into detail, we're both aware that certain factors predispose any given group to become either the victims or the beneficiaries of history. Triumph over adversity is attained through a shared commitment to certain values, and the esteem in which certain qualities are held. We will not be defeated. We will live. We will care for our young. We will feed them, educate them and see them grow strong. We will work for what we must have. We will create. We will dream. We will grow. And these groups have a commonality in the institutions they build: these institutions are crafted well, and infused with the values shared by the group. The most successful of these groups show a strong predeliction for discourse on an international scale. But the success of these groups is most notable in the recognition of the fact that they are the authors of their own fate. I have no quarrel with the claim that some (though not all) Islamic peoples have been treated poorly. So have many other peoples of this world. The question is: what actions are they prepared to take to advance their well-being? If they are arguing that western industrialized nations have been, or will be, predisposed against them, then I would say that is untrue. If they are claiming that we will be unwilling to help them, then I say that is not true. If they say that they have no responsibility for the state of their existence, I say that is not true. Moreover, as long as they continue to believe that, they will be incapable of bettering their lot. I will never claim that we are without blame; neither are we without accountability, or generosity. The existence of haves, and have-nots, is not a simple accident of history. It is as much a reflection of the values practiced and shared among the haves. Best regards, Jim

To: Dayuhan who wrote (11600)	11/26/2001 9:49:32 AM
From: Dennis O'Bell	Respond to of 281500

With respect to anti-colonial resentment, I think it's interesting that the majority of the 9/11 terrorists came from Saudi Arabia, a country rolling in oil money that has never even been colonized. However, SA is an extremely unequal society, perhaps a kind of north-south in miniature. It takes money and education to really do any harm to the West, so SA had the right kind of mix, it might even have been ineluctable that a successful terrorist attack on the US came from people originating there in hindsight. I definitely agree with what you imply about some of the putting on trial of Islam that has gone on. We'll miss the mark to focus too much on Islam itself.