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To: Dan3 who wrote (150709)	12/1/2001 6:55:16 PM
From: wanna_bmw	Respond to of 186894

Dan, Re: "Dell's similar 2U server: Dell doesn't offer P4 Xeon in a server - evidently they think the P4 Xeon isn't any good for servers." Actually, Intel doesn't offer a Netburst based Xeon for servers, yet. Consequently, Dell doesn't offer such a line. However, that's not going to stop others from putting together a Xeon system and calling it a server, but it doesn't mean they are going to get great performance on server apps. I believe you've already observed this. Instead, why don't you compare Intel's fastest 1.2GHz Tualatin to AMD's fastest 1800+ Athlon MP. Quotation for 1 Unit(s) Component Specification -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Motherboard Asus TR-DLS, Dual P3-Tualatin,Ultra160 SCSI, IDE,Video,10/100 Lan,Sset III LE Chipset Serverworks ServerSet III LE Slots 7 x PCI (Total);0 x AGP;2x64bit PCI Maximum RAM 4GB using 4 x 1GB On-board Graphics 4 MB On-board SCSI 2x68 pin Ultra160 On-board LAN 1 x 10/100 Intel Ethernet On-board Audio No CPU 2 x Pentium III 1.2GHz Tualatin, 512k fast cache (d) RAM 512 MB Total using 2 x 256 MB PC133 ECC Registered S-DRAM DIMM SCSI HDD 2 x 36GB 10,000 rpm Ultra160 RAID Controller None SCSI Controller 2x68 pin Ultra160 on-board motherboard IDE HDD 0 x None CD / DVD slim IDE CD included with case Rack Casing 1U CS-RS:2xSCSI SCA HD bays,c/w slimCD, FD,19inX600mm deep.1xPCI 250Wpsu Subsystem None Ethernet 1 x 10/100 Intel Ethernet on-board motherboard Modem None Graphics 4 MB graphics on-board motherboard Monitor None Extra Item 1 None Extra Item 2 None FDD slim 3.5in 1.44 MB floppy included with case Keyboard Logitech Deluxe 104 PS/2 Mouse Microsoft Intellipoint Wheel Mouse PS/2 Operating System MS Windows 2000 Server [licence only, no CALs] Maintenance 4 hour response 1 year on-site maintenance on hardware Unit Price ex. VAT £ 3,637.00 VAT £ 636.48 Total including VAT £ 4,273.48 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quotation for 1 Unit(s) Component Specification -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Motherboard Tyan Thun. K7, Dual Athlon, 5 x PCI [64/32 Bit],AGP Pro, 2x10/100,2x U160 SCSI, AMD760DP Chipset AMD 760MP Slots 5 x PCI (Total);1 x AGP; Maximum RAM 4GB using 4 x 1GB On-board Graphics 4 MB On-board SCSI 2x68 pin Ultra160 On-board LAN 2 x 10/100 3Com Ethernet On-board Audio No CPU 2 x Athlon 1.8 GHz Palomino (MP) RAM 512 MB Total using 2 x 256MB PC2100 DDR Registered ECC SCSI HDD 2 x 36GB 10,000 rpm Ultra160 RAID Controller None SCSI Controller 2x68 pin Ultra160 on-board motherboard IDE HDD 0 x None CD / DVD slim IDE CD included with case Rack Casing 1U CS-RS105:Dual Athlon, 2xSCSI SCA HD bays,slimCD, FD, 600mm deep.1xPCI 400Wpsu Subsystem None Ethernet 2 x 10/100 3Com Ethernet on-board motherboard Modem None Graphics 4 MB graphics on-board motherboard Monitor None Extra Item 1 None Extra Item 2 None FDD slim 3.5in 1.44 MB floppy included with case Keyboard Logitech Deluxe 104 PS/2 Mouse Microsoft Intellipoint Wheel Mouse PS/2 Operating System MS Windows 2000 Server [licence only, no CALs] Maintenance 4 hour response 1 year on-site maintenance on hardware Unit Price ex. VAT £ 3,341.00 VAT £ 584.68 Total including VAT £ 3,925.68 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I see about a £330 difference between the two. The Intel systems is slightly more expensive for what it offers. I'm sure the Athlon at 1.53GHz can easily outrun the Tualatin at 1.2GHz, but I doubt the difference would be more than 20%. This just goes to show that you can prove your point without exaggerating, as you usually do. The only thing to consider is, now that AMD servers beat Intel in price and performance, what has it gained them? <shrug> I still don't hear about Athlon MP systems flying off the shelves. Why don't you think anyone is buying them? wbmw

To: Dan3 who wrote (150709)	12/1/2001 9:17:19 PM
From: steve harris	Respond to of 186894

Dan3, re:DELL I'll never buy a "PC Unlimited" box from Mike. Steve

To: Dan3 who wrote (150709)	12/1/2001 9:33:06 PM
From: Tony Viola	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 186894

Dell's similar 2U server: Dell doesn't offer P4 Xeon in a server - evidently they think the P4 Xeon isn't any good for servers. The Foster Xeon 512K and 1MB cache servers are starting to come out now, like the IBM X360 that was in the press this week. The Foster Xeon small cache version was never on the OEMs' roadmaps for small servers. Instead, Tualatin served as the chip for speedbumps of the small servers, having been in the roadmap for that use for a couple of years.