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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: frankw1900 who wrote (12318)12/1/2001 7:43:30 PM
From: maceng2  Respond to of 281500
 
Hi frankw1900

RE No one expects a government to be as pure as Caesar's wife, but they don't expect a real government to be standing on the corner, either

I am shocked, shocked...

I didn't even know I was part a french man

lol

and best regards all,

pearly



To: frankw1900 who wrote (12318)12/1/2001 8:07:25 PM
From: axial  Read Replies (3) | Respond to of 281500
 
"The war sure as hell is on here. Some of our lumbering communities are going to look bombed out damn soon."

Has it occurred to you that there may be no solution? Has it occurred that this may be just the beginning, and not the end of unilateral actions by the Americans?

What if the Americans just decide to say "To hell with Canada, and NAFTA?" What if they tell us they don't want our wood, our oil, our gas, our power, or our water?

What then?

What will we do? Sit around for a hundred years, moaning that we were ruined by the Americans, or get off our butts and find other markets? NAFTA is open to cancellation by either party on 6 months' notice (if I recall correctly), without cause: for no reason.

Where is it written that Americans are obliged to buy our lumber, in perpetuity?

If the Americans have decided to play hardball, then all the outraged indignation in the world ain't gonna put money in your jeans.

We will have to deal with it, and rebuild export markets.

If unilateralism and protectionism becomes the policy de jour of the United States, then we had better quit whining and start finding someone who does want our products.

I repeat: it's my sincere belief that cooler heads will prevail, and that the benefits of NAFTA will be recognized and reaffirmed.

But: the old relationships may be over. If that's the case (I'll say it again) things are going to get bad - and not just in the lumber industry.

And what kind of people will we prove to be? Whiners, and criers, blaming others, or traders and movers, who rolled with the punches, and moved on to greater things?

If the Americans are presenting us with something unpalatable, we don't have to eat it: we can shove it in their face, where it belongs.

I hate to spoil the Pity Party, but it may be over. Deal with it. It's gonna be tough, but we'll get through it. Let's start acting like people with some jam.

Regards,

Jim



To: frankw1900 who wrote (12318)12/6/2001 2:35:08 AM
From: axial  Respond to of 281500
 
"We will have to deal with it, and rebuild export markets."

Message 16732790
_______________________________________________________

"The council has been working on developing the Chinese lumber market, which MacDonald said has limitless potential.

"The Chinese market, if they hit 15 million homes, if you command a very small percentage of the marketplace . . . it very quickly gets equal to our share of the U.S. market," he said."

______________________________________________________

B.C. forest workers warn of softwood sellout, Pettigrew cheers WTO review

Updated: Wed, Dec 05 6:39 PM EST

VICTORIA (CP) - Forest workers from British Columbia warned Wednesday they will not accept a softwood lumber agreement with the United States that sacrifices their jobs.
More than 300 forest workers, many unemployed and carrying placards, gathered outside the B.C. legislature to tell the government their futures are at stake in any softwood deal. "When you go to the table, you better be thinking about us and you better not come back to B.C. and tell us, 'Oh God, we had to do this. We had to sell out the province to get a deal for Weyerhaeuser,"' said Jim Sinclair, B.C. Federation of Labour president.

American-owned Weyerhaeuser is the largest forest company in B.C., employing thousands in its lumber and pulp mills.

Union leaders and forest community mayors said a softwood deal that allows the United States to process raw B.C. timber in American mills will kill British Columbia's forest industry.

Upwards of 13,000 B.C. forest-industry workers, most of them on the B.C. coast, have been laid off because of the combined impact of punishing U.S. softwood duties and a slump in the lumber business.

Analysts believe the figure could hit 30,000 before any agreement is reached to end the dispute. British Columbia accounts for about half of Canadian softwood exports.

"We are the backbone of the economy of the province of British Columbia and nobody seems to understand that," said IWA-Canada president Dave Haggard, leader of the largest forest union in British Columbia.

Doug Muir, Pulp, Paper and Woodworkers of Canada union president, said raw logs are leaving the province for the U.S. market in greater numbers, threatening B.C. jobs.

"You've got to get in front of that gate of that plant if you're not working," he told the protesters. "Let them know you're not happy."

But a forest industry leader offered a starkly contrasting view Wednesday.

"The softwood lumber issues, I believe, are in hand," Ron MacDonald, president of the B.C. Council of Forest Industries, told the Vancouver Board of Trade.

"I think have been handled quite properly with the leadership that's been shown by the provincial government."

MacDonald said the B.C. forest industry is also leading the way to a resolution in the softwood dispute by putting forward long-term solutions.

He predicted the industry will increase jobs and revenue in British Columbia.

"We believe at some future point that you could see a sustainable annual harvest of probably 90 million to 92 million cubic metres," said MacDonald, comparing it with the current annual cut of 73.3 million cubic metres.

"When you get to that point there's 80,000 new jobs attached to that."

The council has been working on developing the Chinese lumber market, which MacDonald said has limitless potential.

"The Chinese market, if they hit 15 million homes, if you command a very small percentage of the marketplace . . . it very quickly gets equal to our share of the U.S. market," he said.

Meanwhile, Pierre Pettigrew, international trade minister, applauded a World Trade Organization decision Wednesday to establish a panel to review the 19.3 per cent U.S. duty on Canadian softwood lumber.

"We are taking measures to protect the rights of our industry," Pettigrew said.

"The duty is unfair and unwarranted, and while we hope to resolve this issue through negotiations, we are also continuing to pursue the legal options available to us at the WTO."

The U.S. Commerce Department imposed the provisional countervailing against Canadian softwood lumber exports last August after renewed complaints from U.S. producers that Canadian wood was subsidized. Recently, the Americans added a 13 per cent provisional anti-dumping duty.

Canada exported $10 billion worth of softwood to the United States last year.

American producers say Canadian softwood exports are subsidized through low provincial stumpage fees - the royalty charged for logging Crown timber.

MP John Duncan, Alliance international trade critic, said the federal Liberals must ensure Canada does not jump at any settlement offer before having a fair and firm say at the softwood negotiating table.

"We can't have a deal at any cost and it is unlikely to be a good deal in December if the U.S. will only be submitting its first proposals on Dec. 12," he said.

B.C. Forests Minister Mike de Jong said Canada will not cave in at the negotiating table.

"We're not succumbing to the short-term temptation of a Band-Aid solution with the Americans," he said. "The idea is to create a brighter future for families, workers and forest-dependent communities."

Premier Gordon Campbell said British Columbia is working hard to ensure long-term and secure access to the American market.

Forest worker Herman Hanson said Wednesday's protest was necessary because it reminds politicians and the public about the contribution forest workers make to the B.C. economy.

"If woodworkers lose their jobs, there's nobody spending any money in local communities," said Hanson, who works at a mill near Vancouver that recently laid off 300 people.

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