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Pastimes : Understanding Islam -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: Thomas M. who wrote (1019)2/12/2002 5:02:31 PM
From: Sultan  Read Replies (4) | Respond to of 2926
 
<OT>

I see that you guys are still going at it.. Here is something interesting I found on the net while looking for a particular writer.. Nothing about Islam but plenty about religion.. Interesting read..

WHY I AM AN AGNOSTIC
Robert Green Ingersoll

1896

For the most part we inherit our opinions. We are the heirs of habits and mental customs. Our beliefs, like the fashion of our garments, depend on where we were born. We are molded and fashioned by our surroundings.

Environment is a sculptor -- a painter.

If we had been born in Constantinople, the most of us would have said: "There is no God but Allah, and Mohammed is his prophet." If our parents had lived on the banks of the Ganges, we would have been worshipers of Siva, longing for the heaven of Nirvana.

As a rule, children love their parents, believe what they teach, and take great pride in saying that the religion of mother is good enough for them.

Most people love peace. They do not like to differ with their neighbors. They like company. They are social. They enjoy traveling on the highway with the multitude. They hate to walk alone.

The Scotch are Calvinists because their fathers were. The Irish are Catholics because their fathers were. The English are Episcopalians because their fathers were, and the Americans are divided in a hundred sects because their fathers were. This is the general rule, to which there are many exceptions. Children sometimes are superior to their parents, modify their ideas, change their customs, and arrive at different conclusions. But this is generally so gradual that the departure is scarcely noticed, and those who change usually insist that they are still following the
fathers.

It is claimed by Christian historians that the religion of a nation was sometimes suddenly changed, and that millions of Pagans were made into Christians by the command of a king. Philosophers do not agree with these historians. Names have been changed, altars have been overthrown, but opinions, customs and beliefs remained the same. A Pagan, beneath the drawn sword of a Christian, would probably change his religious views, and a Christian, with a scimitar above his head, might suddenly become a Mohammedan, but as a matter of fact both would remain exactly as they were before -- except in speech.

Belief is not subject to the will. Men think as they must. Children do not, and cannot, believe exactly as they were taught. They are not exactly like their parents. They differ in temperament, in experience, in capacity, in surroundings. And so there is a continual, though almost imperceptible change. There is development, conscious and unconscious growth, and by comparing long periods of time we find that the old has been almost abandoned, almost lost in the new. Men cannot remain stationary.

The mind cannot be securely anchored. If we do not advance, we go backward. If we do not grow, we decay. If we do not develop, we shrink and shrivel.

Like the most of you, I was raised among people who knew --who were certain. They did not reason or investigate. They had no doubts. They knew that they had the truth. In their creed there was no guess -- no perhaps.

They had a revelation from God. They knew the beginning of things. They knew that God commenced to create one Monday morning, four thousand and four years before Christ. They knew that in the eternity -- back of that morning, he had done nothing. They knew that it took him six days to make the earth -- all plants, all animals, all life, and all the globes that wheel in space. They knew exactly what he did each day and when he rested. They knew the origin, the cause of evil, of all crime, of all disease and death.

They not only knew the beginning, but they knew the end. They knew that life had one path and one road. They knew that the path, grass-grown and narrow, filled with thorns and nettles, infested with vipers, wet with tears, stained by bleeding feet, led to heaven, and that the road, broad and smooth, bordered with fruits and flowers, filled with laughter and song and all the happiness of human love, led straight to hell. They knew that God was doing his best to make you take the path and that the Devil used every art to
keep you in the road.

infidels.org.



To: Thomas M. who wrote (1019)2/12/2002 6:10:58 PM
From: Colleen M  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 2926
 
Your link reeks of sour grapes!



To: Thomas M. who wrote (1019)2/12/2002 6:45:06 PM
From: haqihana  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 2926
 
Thomas M, There was nothing inflammatory in the remarks by President Bush. Iran is, in fact, under the influence of an evil regime. To begin with, the Quran tells all Muslims that it is their duty to kill all Infidels whenever, and however, they can, regardless of provocation. In case you need some education, Infidels are any persons who are not Muslim. That, clearly, indicates that their intentions are to murder, by whatever means at their disposal, any one who is not Muslim. The Ayatollah Khomeini said, in public that; "We shall export our revolution, to the whole world, until the cry 'Allah Akbar' resounds over the whole world. There will be struggle. There will be Jihad...Islam is the religion of militant individuals...Islam will be victorious in all the countries of the world, and Islam and the teachings of the Quran will prevail all over the world...This is the duty all Muslims must fulfil..."

As you can see, if you deign to look, the quote of John Ashcroft, is exactly correct.

You are the one that has it all wrong. Feeling the way you do, I will be happy to start up a fund to buy you a one-way ticket to Iran, so you can see for yourself what the truth is. At 29, you are still wet behind the ears, and have much to learn, but you will learn nothing from the biased, and bogus, website that you linked.



To: Thomas M. who wrote (1019)2/12/2002 9:34:39 PM
From: uu  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 2926
 
Tom:

> However, this year there was a large spontaneous turnout, in reaction to George Bush's inflammatory remarks about Iran being part of the "axis of evil".

Do you have any idea how many Iranians (in Tehran and other large cities in Iran) celebrated on the day George Bush made those comments about Iran being "axis of evil"? And you know why they celebrated? For the first time in 23 years there is some hope that someone is about to do something about the Islamic thugs who have taken over Iran for since 1979. There is a hope that America is about to take care of the Islamic regime of Iran as they did with the Taliban.

And NO, you do not hear that on MSNBC, or NBC, or CNN, but you see it and hear it if you live in Iran! However I believe - based on what I am being told from friends and family in Iran - that this time around Islamic thugs of the regime are gradually losing their intimidation on the average joe on the street, so I think CNN, and MSNBC will also soon be reporting of what is really going on Iran - besides the idiotic propaganda superficial demonstrations that went on this past Monday and Tuesday!


The only reason you saw a somewhat large spontaneous turnout was simply a matter of better than normal manipulative propaganda put up by the Islamic regime targeting the very same people who are heavily dependent on its monthly charity program.