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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: LindyBill who wrote (19102)	2/17/2002 10:54:49 AM
From: Ilaine	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

You're right about the Catholic connection vis-a-vis the Cold War. I was brought up Catholic, attended Catholic schools, and was lectured to repeatedly about "Godless Communism." The Communists took great pleasure in mistreating Catholic missionaries, priests and nuns. Communists hated Catholics, Catholics hated Communism. Interesting how in Poland the Catholic connection was very strong in Solidarity. Interesting how Poland gave others in Communist countries the strength to change the regimes. Maybe the Communists were right to hate the Catholics.-g- It's a different story in Latin America, though. Lots of leftist Catholics. A friend of mine rants about machine-gun toting missionary Maryknoll nuns. -g- However, the oppressors are also nominally Catholic.

To: LindyBill who wrote (19102)	2/17/2002 12:21:37 PM
From: 49thMIMOMander	Respond to of 281500

I thought is was fairly clear that Kennedy and Kruschev kind of cooperated against, outmaneuvering their own domestic hawks, seems much of the "Cuba Crises" was "staged" to achieve that, besides the agreement to stop setting up missiles around each other, especially in unstable nations. - get the hawks in both nations to really understand what they were playing with - make JFK into an "american hero", a strong enough president to follow through with that (he started out as a very weak president) It seem as all agreements made then are still not declassified, so there is maybe more to come in another 10-20 years, at least when the USA-Cuba situation is normalized. Btw, I think it was, maybe, Kruschev son, who said something that Kruschev trusted Kennedy to be able to handle the situation. Some also point to a lot of contacts between some russians and Robert Kennedy before the crises. The tapes seem to serve the point of showing how the US hawks struggled with a possible reality of an escalation and a real crises, occupation,etc. as well as changing their old (nuclear) hawkish thoughts. Another point is that ground based missiles were already about to lose their strategic importance as it turned to submarines . (with the more recent result that the same submarine equipment, not needed anymore, was used to find Titanic and make money on the movie) Ilmarinen Besides above successes both Kennedy and Kruschev were gotten rid of, the hawks in SU put Kruschev on a little pension, worse for both Kennedys. Btw, another stabilizing improvment was the "hot line" from the white house to Kreml. Btw,btw, one view on the mutual withdrawal, the russian in the open, while the USA-turkey was kept secrete, is that the most important thing was that those who are supposed to know knew about it. Although the turkey thing was just recently declassified in USA, it has been well known outside USA, although handled with some diplomacy. The rest must probably wait until USA-Cuba is more normalized. (Russian, already available to some degree, and Cuban documents, the cubans have already said something like that) Maybe in time for the 50 year anniversary?? (there was 25 or maybe 30? year conference in Spain(?) with many of those personally involved participating) Another connection is that the US assassinations made it possible to pass civil rights in both houses.