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Politics : Should God be replaced? -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Grandk who wrote (11225)	2/26/2002 7:08:38 PM
From: epicure	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 28931

You believe you put on Christ in the same way Buddhists believe that some people can reach enlightenment in this life. But you can't prove it- the sameness in all "beliefs" is that they are beliefs- no matter how "real" they are to the people who believe them. You may believe you believe something very special, and very different- but I tell you, as someone looking in at belief from the outside, they all look very similar- even if you "feel" your belief is very special. I'm sure it is special to you, but to anyone else, who isn't you, or who doesn't believe like you, it isn't special.

To: Grandk who wrote (11225)	2/28/2002 6:22:10 AM
From: 2MAR$	Respond to of 28931

Well, the problem I would have is that Buddha is dead and Christ is risen and alive. Well we have that lovely quote & praise of Buddha from HG Wells in some small disagreement with you in the univerality of the teachings of Buddha ....even seeing it as more lucid , clear and less ambiguous than that of Jesus . Lovely quote this from one who captured the imaginations of millions Message 17117102 If there ever was a religion for the 21rst century , it would be Buddhism , which is both my view and one expressed by Albert Einstein as well. So there are at least 3 of us that will disagree with you . I respect the sincerity of your beliefs , but will always question the claim of a physical Resurrection of a dead human being as a central cornerstone to the validity of his Supreme Godhood, the religion itself...just as I have regarded and noticed the gradual belief in the "Miracles" also ascribed to this person become de-emphasized in more modern times . (They are not mentioned even once in the writings of Paul ) Since I have always regarded all "Life" itself as an ongoing work (miracle) in progress , and usually completely in awe of everything I come to know about it , whether looking backwards , forwards or in the present . So Miracles? Childbirth for me is certainly one . It is unessential and unimpresive to me such claims that Jesus was the only man to be risen from the dead , or that he walked upon the water , or fed the multitudes with only several fishes and a few loaves of bread...or curing the leper to inspire me to awe. Those several miracles , BTW , were already ascribed to Buddha who lived 500 yrs before in exact and every detail . When I look objectively upon this reliance on some supernatural feat of rising from the dead I can only think of a story/fable created to sway a potential believer of those times circulated to inspire awe and impact of the teachings . I find this Christianity's weakest link, but according to Saul , all the faith must rest upon this "Fact". But Saul had many issues himself , I think were never fully resolved , but so in Corinth Christianity was truely born from Pauls preachings. (I don't think Saul ever conquered his guilt and shame for being a persecuter) The mythic parallel & model of such Godmen attaining immortality and being risen to heaven was already completely ingrained in both the Egyptian , Roman and Grecian minds . In Hercules , Osirus , etc etc. So , to my mind it seems the most plausible reality that this "rising from the dead was a cap put on the ending of the story to achieve exactly the kind of impact upon the new listener and sway his mind towards belief and acceptance. You have to remember that many Barbarians were "converted" to Christianity by Roman Emperors , then their forces were used as terrible weapons of spreading the faith by unleashing them against the pagan and resisting gentiles with extreme ruthlessness. Such a story was capable of producing "awe" in a barbarian's mind . In fact the story of Hercules , who also rose up from the dead (Hades) after many trials set before him on Earth , was one of the most popular myths of that time and place ...for over 1000yrs. To shorten this post and end for now , I'll only say that to my mind it is far nobler and much more awe inspiring that such a teacher as Buddha chose to live and teach for over 50yrs , a teaching so subtle and universal and wise ...but then to martyr himself so quickly after a ministry of only 3 yrs as Jesus chose to do ? I would rather believe in the one that chose to stay and live on. You must remember how disappointed the Apostles were and how they fled the scene of the crucifiction , seeing their Messiah die so easily when they expected his "Kingdom Come" to be brought before them while he lived . Their faith was completely shaken and they ran away. It was because they were thinking he was the Messiah fortold , and such a one could not die before establishing the kingdom. In a way Jesus did ...but of the entire Earth , Jesus did nothing without Buddha before him. The point I'm trying to make to you is your reply was expected , but in each person/teacher you see the great seeds of a new approach to living . One that precludes all the horror of Wars and terrible strife that has routinely ripped man's worlds apart for centuries. The message of Buddha was clear. I'll also remind you that the term "Buddha" not only refers to one person but a series of such enlighten beings . I will grant you that Jesus may have been a Buddha as well . But telling me he rose from the dead is the least important point . What one does celebrate is the gift of their teaching at all, and choosing to share what they knew while they lived . I could never believe in such a myth , but certain sybolic triumphs could have been attained at the last by Jesus the man certainly ...a liberation and final realization of the greatest compassion , for his work was finished. This is your Jesus here rjgeib.com * Nikos Kazantzakis taught me to love your Christ , like no other I've read , for he taught me about Jesus the man and , not the demi God > The man was greater .

To: Grandk who wrote (11225)	2/28/2002 6:43:12 AM
From: 2MAR$	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 28931

This is your Jesus here rjgeib.com * Nikos Kazantzakis taught me to love your Christ , like no other I've read , for he taught me about Jesus the man and , not the demi God > The man was far greater , more real and believable . The rest of the stories they made up were uneccessary . Of course they misunderstood and persecuted poor Nikos Kazantzakis , who's writings of Jesus were of the most sacred and personal kind . Great author & human being... and lover of Christ. Poor Christianity, sometimes so lost. ...but if he did die on that cross as millions of others did during those ruthless times , and died for the core beliefs of love and compassion , of course I would sing his praise and do often . That was a great noble death for truth. That is where the word Christian was coined from. Those who saw the early apostles saw Christ in them. So they said "The Lord is There." From that we get Christianity, or "one with Christ". So, there is a big difference between Christianity and Buddhism. The more you knew of Buddha , the more you would know Christ. For he was the Compassionate one . In this century the truth will win out ...little Buddha's truths are God's Truths....he was just too humble a teacher to go that far. But you may call it God's truth if you wish ! the more you come to love him , the more you know him , the more you come to know him , the more you love him little Buddhist saying .... ;-)