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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: KyrosL who wrote (20178)	2/27/2002 9:20:55 PM
From: Nadine Carroll	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

This, aka "the right of return", is a bargaining chip to be exchanged for complete and total Israeli withdrawal from the territories occupied in 1967. One might think so, except the eleventh hour came, everything was aligned for a deal providing 95% return of the territories, with land swaps on the table, and the right of return didn't get used as a bargaining chip -- it was introduced just then and it broke the deal, as all sides knew it would. Arafat moved the goal posts farther away, not closer. And would it be to much to remind you that recognizing Israel's existence was one of basic principles of the Oslo accords, by which he got the land he controls now? I am sure you are aware that Israel can easily reoccupy any piece of Palestine it wants to, as it has convincingly demonstrated over and over again lately. With the Arab world and Europe blaming only Israel, no matter what the circumstances, as we have seen. Do you think Israel wants to withdraw only as prelude to reconquest when Hamas begins firing Katyushas over the wall? am surprised you regard the Saudi proposal with such cynicism. I think it's a dream come true for Israel -- and the US. Suddenly, the world looks a lot rosier, IMO. Perhaps you are unfamiliar with the Saudi's previous times floating this deal. They needed a charm offensive in the US then, too. This op-ed covers some of the history. latimes.com

To: KyrosL who wrote (20178)	2/27/2002 11:37:35 PM
From: Ilaine	Read Replies (5) \| Respond to of 281500

>>I am surprised you regard the Saudi proposal with such cynicism. I think it's a dream come true for Israel -- and the US. Suddenly, the world looks a lot rosier, IMO.<< Me, too. But I think that there is a very hard core in Israel, and without, that does not see withdrawal to pre-1967 lines as a viable alternative, no matter what. Nadine is on record (I think, maybe she can correct me) as stating that this would be acceptable if the Arabs did what the Crown Prince is suggesting. But I fear that even if the Crown Prince were able to bring the Arabs AND the PLO to the bargaining table, it would be a hard sell to a significant part of Sharon's coalition. You and I had a discussion about this last year, long before 9/11. I said that I thought that the most orthodox religious element in Israel would not compromise. Others argued that Israel was a secular state, and the most orthodox did not have that much power. Can't remember what you said but you disagreed with my assessment that the most deeply religious Jews would not compromise. Funny how after 9/11 it has become more acceptable to attribute religious motives towards actors in the secular world.