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Pastimes : THE SLIGHTLY MODERATED BOXING RING -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Neocon who wrote (784)	3/2/2002 9:15:15 PM
From: thames_sider	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 21057

he ... seems to think that adaptive traits arise according to need I can't comment on most of your slurs, save to wonder at your disagreement with so many neutrals... nonzero.org I'm sure you're not biassed about it. Meanwhile, on your 'surreptitious imports of teleological arguments' (grammar changes mine). [he] seems to think that adaptive traits arise according to need, are sex specific, and are fine-tuned No, this is NOT requiring a designer. Let me try and put it in simple bullet points. - billions of years. - billions of failed - dead - extinct - creatures. - billions of combinations. - we see the survivors. - of course they're bldy adapted to their environment, that's why they survived and the others didn't. - the better they are at something, the more reason for them to flourish. Traits survive according to usefulness**. By definition, the traits that survive are probably useful (or at least not harmful, or more expensive to support than they were worth). The useless or over-expensive traits die out as those relying on them starve or get no mates. Hence, looking back, only the useful traits are visible. So it looks as though they were pre-destined - they arose according to need. Wrong... the unneeded traits just didn't survive. You're looking at one sequence, and of course what's already happened looks like coincidence - but it's just what happened, no more. This is not that hard a concept. Roll a die, ten times. Note the results. What are the odds of that sequence? Slim, obviously... but it happened.