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Pastimes : Ask and You Shall Receive -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Jane Hafker who wrote (3615)	3/2/2002 7:39:48 PM
From: gregor	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 14396

Dear Jane: What a good pleasure it is to have you back. You and only you can get my spirit rev'ed up like those new, re emerging Dodge race cars , one of which won the Datona 500, and by the way driven by a Virginia boy Ward Burton. No I am not a Nascar fan. Either you or the Holy Spirit went to school on my last post about steadfastness and power as I was speaking of in my last post about Mark chap 9 and the relationship to Elijah. The Holy Spirit needs little tiny urges to lead you as you are so attuned to His leading. Dare I get you started on The Dark Ages when the Roman church took upon itself to protect all of us from misinterpreting God's Word. Those comments that Peter made about Paul. Could it be that they were founded in that stubbornness, and hard headedness that Peter was known for. Paul , did he not preach the complete abolishment of the old law of Moses: which you know he only preached to the gentiles; whereas Peter's ministry was confined primarily to the Jews. Can we not open healthy discussion on this point. When Christ taught that you do not mend an old garment with a new piece of cloth of course He might have been speaking of our old sinful nature , that we need to cast the whole garment off and replace it with an entirely new garment. That our old sinful self will be hard to repair that we struggle against the old nature lest we put it all off and take on the new garment of righteousness that Christ provides..........OR........was it the old law that He wanted us to discard, to strip off completely. ( I will be honest with you ,,this still causes me to struggle ) and put on that new garment. But we are not ignorant of what the old garment had become to the Jews. Adherance to strictly of the law. If by grace we cast it off then what part shall we keep ? How can it be that we can cast it all off ? What then shall protect us from God's wrath ? What shall cover our nakedness.? What an irony and what a trap. That to be covered we must first be uncovered. God knows all of us anyway. Why do we find it so difficult to go naked in front of Him, to be covered anew; but I say unto you that is His requirement. and I am still not at all comfortable doing so and that still causes me problems as I feel it also caused Peter problems..IN CHRIST

To: Jane Hafker who wrote (3615)	3/4/2002 6:11:41 PM
From: Jane Hafker	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 14396

Sure wish Shalom would drop in too, if only for a few days so we could scratch away more of the surfaces here. I didn't have the luxury of reading ANY posts on this thread, and certainly not yours on Mark, where is it? Correction on my theory of John's bad press that never goes away, you would have recognized Gal 1-8 if I had said, "if anyone brings you any other "gospel". That's what Paul used, "gospel". However, to me "gospel" is nothinmg more than the embodiment of all that is Jesus Christ, without which there is no gospel, period. But it is Gal 1-8. And Paul didn't say run away, he actually said that anyone changing or reinventing or attributing anything "new" to Jesus that that person is accursed, or cursed, just as John cursed all who would be nice and helpful and try to explain away some of the incredible things God showed John in his writing of Rev. No, as for Peter, we hit on my greatest sore point in all of Christendom. At no time in my walk, without any exception, anywhere, was I ever under any cultish, deluded, almost quaisi-satanic in nature "church" (that includes all manner of pentacost, Walkman Nee, and all private offshots of the Jesus Freak movement in California, up to and including deluded disciples of "Children of God", which like Jones' nightmare in Gayana, was at first a much respected "move of the Holy Spirit, and you just HAVE to get over to their church in Ukiah!!!!!"...(breath)....that said leaders were not almost exclusively teaching only from Paul. Without whom, of course, we get absolutely NO scriptural admonitions to be under ANYONE save the Holy Spirit of Jesus Christ. And I believe that was what Peter saw, that people were twisting Paul and coming up witih the obvious conclusion that they were something of little kings and popes who had been ordained to start their own little kingdoms. Most of whom are rarely really "submitted" to anyone at all, and again, the teachings of Paul are used to show that said leaders of old simply were designated apostles, period. How did I find that scripture? Once while agonizing over that exact curiousity--the obsession with Paul's teachings on submission to designated authorities, even over the comment of Jesus who clearly said, "WHY do you ask me what is right and wrong? ...[you have the inner holy spirit to tell you that], whatever he said exactly. Also call no man father save God in heavena dn on and on and on. During that time of agonizing all that I know, and all I know that happened is I found myself curiously flipping to the last page of Peter, and there popping into my eyesight was that scripture. I said Thank you Lord, I was worried there for a minute. My time is up here unfortunately. But if there was no problelm it is IMPOSSIBLE Peter could have written such a thing. Remember that Peter risked a horrible death defending Jesus, and remember that John tried to go inside with Jesus but they threw him out of the inner door. I don't have a bible here, sorry. By!!