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To: thames_sider who wrote (2382)3/13/2002 8:32:09 AM
From: Neocon  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 21057
 
The idea that Ashcroft is riding roughshod over the Constitution is ludicrous. "Due process" is not spelled out in the Constitution, but is a matter of custom, statute, and judicial precedent. It is always the case that public order and due process must be balanced out. There are many of us that think that an interest in substantive justice and the maintenance of order has been subverted by due process considerations in the last 40 years. Nevertheless, those decisions are matters of judicial precedent, for example, the exclusionary rule should there be warrant irregularities. In the case of Ashcroft, he proposed legislation that expedited a few police powers, and did so with legislative authority, when the matter involved alleged terrorism. This does not exactly effect the criminal on the street, much less the ordinary citizen. One can agree or disagree with the terms of the action, but it is still not riding "roughshod".

Bush is neither incompetent, nor much of a liar (I will not swear he is unfailingly honest). He got SAT scores that put him in the top 10- 15 percent of college bound students in an era before one could use calculators. He is not dumb. He is not even inarticulate. I have watched him in interviews, and he is perfectly responsive and charming, and rarely stumbles. It is clear enough that he stumbles when he would rather be slangy than formal, and has to be formal. As for idle rich smugness, he was never particularly idle, and is credited with making the Rangers into a team that attracted a large sale, as managing partner. As for intolerance, the man has appointed women and minorities into important posts. I should hang a lot on his attitude towards gay marriage. Finally, I am sorry that you automatically think that capitalism must reflect class interests (are you part of the Trotskyite faction of the Labour Party), but that is a matter of ideological disagreement. In these parts, being pro- market and a man of the people is not personally a matter of hypocrisy, even if you think it is ideologically deluded.

As for speaking down to Michael, when I see you try reason, intelligence, or polysyllables, I will let you know if it seems futile.

Actually, I have not said much about what I think of you. I have merely questioned a characterization or two on the basis of some quotes.........



To: thames_sider who wrote (2382)3/13/2002 3:36:01 PM
From: Michael M  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 21057
 
"I can live with incompetence in politicians, I expect them to lie, and they don't have to be the brightest flames in the fire."
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No wonder you favored Gore, Thames Slider. That and the fact he had a knack for making all words seem polysyllabic.

If elected, I suspect he'd have airmailed his regards on 9/11 (ala Sudan) and appointed a large presidential commission, chaired by Jimmy Carter, to study and comment on terrorism.

As this cluster **** lurched along arguing about the diversity of its own composition and what words and terms could be used without offending anyone, Prince Albert (who, as a child, walked miles, barefoot in the snow, to get to school, you know) would be freed to stalk the tube every night, urging ratification of a-greeeee-ments reached by huuuuuun-dreds and huuuuuun-dreds of couuuuun-tries in Kyyyyy-ooooo-to, Ja-paaaaaaan to save the ennn-viiii-ronnnnnn-memmmmmmnt.

Give me a good old "Wanted - dead or alive" speech any day.