I am so fed up with your cute but deadly games in trying to make a discussion ABOUT racism...a THEATER of racism. I can tell you outright that you can go to Hell.
Because of your ugly continuation of this, which I have asked you repeatedly to stop, I will include a few jokes in my post to hopefully dissuade others from a too heavy focus on the misdirection which your cowardice and low character is promoting. The Jewish People have invented some of the most wonderful humour around. I will share sonme of it throughout this rant while I am giving you yet another spanking...
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A man walks into synagogue with a dog. The shammas (caretaker) comes up to him and says, "Pardon me, this is a House of Worship, you can't bring your dog in here." "What do you mean," says the man, "this is a Jewish dog. Look." And the shammas looks carefully and sees that in the same way that a St. Bernard carries a brandy barrel round its neck this dog has a tallis* bag round its neck.
"Rover," says the man, "daven!".
"Woof!" says the dog, stands on his hind legs, opens the tallis* bag, takes out a kipa*** and puts it on his head.
"Woof!" says the dog, stands on his hind legs, opens the tallis bag, takes out a tallis and puts it round his neck.
"Woof!" says the dog, stands on his hind legs, opens the tallis bag, takes out a siddur**** and starts to daven.
"That's fantastic," says the shammas, "absolutely amazing, incredible! You should take him to Hollywood, get him on television, get him in the movies, he could make a million dollars!!"
"You speak to him," says the man, "he wants to be a dentist."
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FIRST
Genesis 12:7 And the LORD appeared unto Abram, and said, Unto thy seed will I give this land:
13:11 Then Lot chose him all the plain of Jordan; and Lot journeyed east: and they separated themselves the one from the other.
ONLY the seed of Abram is to dwell in Palestine. It is willed and ordained by God.
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SECOND
13:15 For all the land which thou seest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed for l ever.
Does it need explaining?
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THIRD
15:13 And he said unto Abram, Know of a surety that thy seed shall be a stranger in a land [that is] not theirs, and shall serve them; and they shall afflict them four hundred years;
God assures Abram that "his seed" will encounter racism and slavery. Sort of a double entendre of racism.
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FOURTH
17:10 This [is] my covenant, which ye shall keep, between me and you and thy seed after thee; Every man child among you shall be circumcised.
17:11 And ye shall circumcise the flesh of your foreskin; and it shall be a token of the covenant betwixt me and you.
17:14 And the uncircumcised man child whose flesh of his foreskin is not circumcised, that soul shall be cut off from his people; he hath broken my covenant.
A blood covenant as regards the souls of the uncircumcised who shall be cut off from "HIS PEOPLE". An uncircumcised man is inferior and unsuited to "THE PEOPLE"? Nope, no racism in the bible...<gg>
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FIFTH
19:3 And Moses went up unto God, and the LORD called unto him out of the mountain, saying, Thus shalt thou say to the house of Jacob, and tell the children of Israel;
19:4 Ye have seen what I did unto the Egyptians, and [how] I bare you on eagles' wings, and brought you unto myself.
God declares his love and prejudice for the seed of Jacob.
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SIXTH
7:12 Wherefore it shall come to pass, if ye hearken to these judgments, and keep, and do them, that the LORD thy God shall keep unto thee the covenant and the mercy which he sware unto thy fathers:
(f) This covenant is grounded in his free grace: therefore in recompensing their obedience, he respects his mercy and not their merits.
7:16 And thou shalt consume all the people which the LORD thy God shall deliver thee; thine eye shall have no pity upon them: neither shalt thou serve their gods; for that [will be] a snare unto thee.
7:20 Moreover the LORD thy God will send the hornet among them, until they that are left, and hide themselves from thee, be destroyed.
There is not a creature so small, that I will not arm it to fight on your side against them.
7:22 And the LORD thy God will put out those nations before thee by little and little: thou mayest not consume them at once, lest the beasts of the field increase upon thee.
What a pretty example of racial IMPARTIALITY, eh Neocon?? One of a plethora of disgusting examples of racism in the bible. Absolutely disgusting.
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SEVENTH
Malachi
2:3 Behold, I will corrupt your seed, and spread dung upon your faces, [even] the dung of your solemn feasts; and [one] shall take you away with it.
The seed you sow will come to no profit.
You boast of your holiness, sacrifices, and feasts, but they will turn to your shame and be as vile as dung.
2:4 And ye shall know that I have sent this commandment unto you, that my covenant might be with Levi, saith the LORD of hosts.
(NO RACISM HERE ;-) ;-) Nothing special about the covenant with Levi!! Nothing that a little dung spread over the face won't fix! Nothing indicative about spreading Dung on the faces of people who are from the wrong seed??<ggg>
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In old Russia, two beggars sat next to each other in a district where few Jews lived. One held a sign saying "Please help the war veteran", and the other holds a sign saying "Please help a poor Jew".
People pass by and even those who didn't intend to give money to either of them, give to the first beggar to upset the Jew. Finally, one day a good man passes by, gives money equally to both, and then says to the Jew: "Why don't you change your sign? Don't you understand that nobody will give you any money?" and walks away. As he goes, the Jew turns to the other beggar and says: "Chaim, he would teach us business..."
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EIGHTH
17:7 Now therefore thus shalt thou say unto my servant David, Thus saith the LORD of hosts, I took thee from the sheepcote, [even] from following the sheep, that thou shouldest be ruler over my people Israel
MY PEOPLE! Nothing racist about that when said by the Supreme Being!
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NINTH
EZRA 9:2 For they have taken of their daughters for themselves, and for their sons: so that the holy Race have mingled themselves with the people of [those] lands: yea, the hand of the princes and rulers hath been chief in this trespass.
9:3 And when I heard this thing, I rent my garment and my mantle, and plucked off the hair of my head and of my beard, and sat down astonied.
The Holy Seed. The Holy Race. Talk about some people sitting at the back of the bus. But it turned out to be a great deal more than that when whole races were EXTERMINATED.
In Ezra 10:2-3, the Jews are going to set aside their non-Jewish wives and the children born to those wives. Would they set aside Jewish wives or children?? Is the Jewish Bible egalitarian, Neo the Con?
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TENTH
"The whole land of Canaan, where you are now an alien, I will give as an everlasting possession to you and your descendants after you; and I will be their God."
Nah...not a racial preference...
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What a pathetic effort to redeem yourself, LOL! So you are unable to counter any of the examples I gave that God favoured the Seed of Isaac over the seed of Abraham through Keturah? You were unable to give one solitary retort against these examples!
Now you come with your best fustian whacko jabbering, and you list a couple of things in the bible which are not emphasizing the centrality of the "Chosen People"--the Chosen People whom are the pith and the core of the Jewish bible.
You know full well that the bible was scratched together from a number of sources over many centuries, so naturally we find a variety of material within the pages. What you are wilfully not comprehending is the simple matter that the ability to find a couple of generous acts between races does not answer the case of defending the chapters and the verses that were brutal.
The Old Testament is not the Old Testament under Judaism. It is called the Jewish Bible or the Torah. It is called that because (for the Jews) it is not about any other religion. It is about the children from the line of Isaac...THE CHILDREN OF ISRAEL. It is about their holy covenant with God in which God promises to favour them as his people...against all others and against all nations.
Your comment on Abraham being from the Chaldees is irrelevant to the one-sided discussion we have been having. It is not all of Abraham's seed which went to the Chosen People, upon whom God bestowed the covenan...writing the truth within their hearts and forgiving them--AND ONLY THEM-- for all time.
Your comment on Ruth points to a biblical book which is one of the most decent in the bible, and one which I did not require any defence of from you. Again, your comment that there were gentiles in the bible treated decently does not answer the genocide ordered by God, nor does it answer the entire book of Ezra which is a lament that the "Holy Seed" has been mixed with alien blood. (Ruth did become a Jew, by the way.)
Why is it Holy Seed? Judaism does not avoid this question. Judaism is based upon the covenant with god which made the Children of the tribes of Israel the Holy People. So, far from avoiding the question...they exalt in it, as well they should. It is you who dishonour the tenets of Judaism by your ill-conceived and feckless defence.
I adduced huge numbers of quotes which showed racial favouritism, and which stated outright the inherent superiority of the children of Israel--the Children who were led in battle after battle by THEIR God--against races such as the Midiamites and the Edomites. One expects the Jewish bible to be about the Jewish people, and to argue a Jewish perspective--does one not??
You have taken a fool's position from the beginning and have flailed weakly against the winds of an overwhelming and unremitting truth: that the Chosen People have a special covenant with God.
This is the central pride of Judaism. It is the linchpin of the Jewish faith and the hope for their future expectations of a Messiah who will be their King and restore their Monarchy. It is you who dishonour them by denying the central tenets of Judaism. Your feckless retreats into some decent parts of the bible, while ignoring every single fact that went to structure the overwhelming argument and unassailable evidence that the Jewish Bible is the history of a special relationship and covenants with a special people who were led by God to exterminate other races to the last man and the last gasp of the bleeding and dying children, does you a dishonour, and it shows your inability to grapple with facts; as well, it highlights your ability to evade, dodge, misrepresent and mislead.
You did not answer what Holy Seed was; but it was not because you did not know. Indeed you did know...and that is why you did not answer. I am tired of your wheedling and your weaselling. And I am tired of your racial slurs against me, and of your smart ass innuendoes.
Everyone knows that almost all of the thousands of religions which have existed have had their beginning in a distinct group of people. They all paint their own colours and characters on their religious Gods. Much has been written about the racial origins of various religions. There is nothing reactionary in the well understood appreciation of the Bible as a primitive history of racial warfare within the set and setting of a Divine an favoured paradigm. ONLY A COMPLETE IDIOT WOULD PRETEND THAT THESE ELEMENTS ARE NOT PROMINENT. What is the matter with you??
Your grandstanding on how you are being wounded is beginning to make me nauseous. You act as if I am inventing what is common scholarship. You act as if I am presenting some arguable theory which you and others are not conversant with. And you act as if intellectual honesty ought to be avoided because modern people are just too primitive to understand. Fella..we are modern because we HAVE left primitivity behind. We do not need to sweep racial horrors under the table. You may if you wish.
When we follow the mythos of the Jewish Bible we find that the seed of Ishmael became the Arab peoples. They are not the Chosen People in the Jewish Bible. They may be in the Koran; but in the Jewish Bible they are NOT. You know that God had a special covenant with the seed of Isaac through Jacob. The Jewish Bible is a history of that special choosing of a people by God, and the special protection and favouritism by God for HIS PEOPLE. Indeed, God led the seed of Isaac personally in battles to extinguish other Nations. I showed you the example of the genocide against the Midiamites where He helped them kill thousands upon thousands of people...and not ONE SINGLE LIFE was lost from the seed of Isaac. This is not a racial preference? Grow up, Neocon.
I have wasted far too much of my time on you. You know you have no argument. You lost before you began. You and I both know why you did not try to answer the arguments which were placed in front of you, but instead abandoned any pretence at reason, and indulged your nastiness by using racial slurs against me. We both know that name calling is not an argument; and we both know it is the resort of those whom have nothing of intelligence to add to the discussion It does not recommend your character to me. Having lost the capacity to be fair, decent, and above board...you have become distasteful to me, and a drain upon my time and my patience. Now grab your marbles and skedaddle.
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'You shall be my own possession among all nations. You shall be a kingdom of priests and a holy nation.'
They are one people, united by their common ancestors, the patriarchs Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. God promised to give Abraham the land of Canaan Palestine/Israel 'for an everlasting possession'.
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I could give a fiddler's Stradivarius about dancing around with you on all the modern variants of Judaism, or the differences in orthodoxy which have been practised, and the myriad differences which have defined the Jewish people over millennia. I am not interested in discussing that the Chosen People have two talmuds to reflect the extreme differences in belief and custom which express Jewish diversity. I am not interested in discussing with you the animosity and fighting which has accompanied this diversity. I am not interested in the fact that there is intermarriage amongst some Jewish groups and not in others. That was not our discussion. Our discussion was on whether or not a book based on the theme of establishing one bloodline...the seed of Isaac as a Holy Chosen People was DE FACTO racist, and on whether or not the primitive people of biblical times practised racism against each other, as well as racial wars of extermination. I suppose you do not believe that enslaving a people is racist? It wasn't racist when the pharaoh did it? It wasn't racist when the Israelites did it, RIGHT? You truly must be somewhat of a mixed up person.
It is not racist for a certain people--ANY people to consider that they are entitled by divine right to certain land? This belief is not a reflection of moral worth and racial distinction??
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"It is important to note that being a Jew has nothing to do with what you believe or what you do. A person born to non-Jewish parents who has not undergone the formal process of conversion but who believes everything that Orthodox Jews believe and observes every law and custom of Judaism is still a non-Jew, even in the eyes of the most liberal movements of Judaism, and a person born to a Jewish mother who is an atheist and never practices the Jewish religion is still a Jew, even in the eyes of the ultra-Orthodox. In this sense, Judaism is more like a nationality than like other religions, and being Jewish is like a citizenship."
"The Hasidim are the ultra-orthodox wing of Judaism. Living in isolation from the Gentile world, these Jews maintain a strict commitment to the Law in every phase of life. They are characterized by their distinctive style of dress (including black coats and ear locks) and their joyful form of worship (song and dance). The movement was founded in Europe by Israel Baal Shem Tov (1700-60). The Hasidim have many sects around the world, each led by its own rebbe. In the United States, the sects of the Lubavitch and Satmar are especially influential."
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EVERYTHING has to come down to anti-semitism for you, RIGHT? You cannot even sustain the appearance of having a debate about the primitive underpinnings of religion, without whining about how special you are, and how everyone else may be accused of racism, but it is beyond conception that it should exist in a Jew, or that it should have existed at the primordial birth of human thought. What a whacko you are, sometimes.
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"The whole land of Canaan, where you are now an alien, I will give as an everlasting possession to you and your descendants after you; and I will be their God." (Genesis 17:8.)
'You shall be my own possession among all nations. You shall be a kingdom of priests and a holy nation.'
They are one people, united by their common ancestors, the patriarchs Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. God promised to Abraham not only to make him and his descendants a great nation but also to give them the land of Canaan 'for an everlasting possession' (Palestine/Israel).
Do you mean to tell me that a Nation favoured by God through covenant and promised land and eternal favour through covenant...is not a morally superior people? Do you mean to tell me that a devout Jew who believes in the biblical promises of the Jewish Bible, does not remark any moral difference between himself and the non Jewish? What a hypocrite and phoney you are.
It is not racist for a certain people--ANY people to consider that they are entitled by divine right to certain land? This belief is not a reflection of moral worth and racial distinction??
As the Israeli human-rights activist Israel Shahak wrote, "Anti-Semitism and Jewish chauvinism can only be fought simultaneously."
So get your little name calling crybaby ass in gear, and get with the program. Even though I have not met you, I know you like the proverbial book: You have never picked a rock or thrown a bale of hay in your life. You have lived like a pansy, and you don't understand either dirt or a cow's teat. You are very dainty--fine. But you are also supercilious and disingenuous. |
